OS2 World.Com Forum

Subject  :  Sun to open source Java (?)
Author  :  Martin
Date  :  29 Jun, 2006 on 16:48
Well, according to some articles posted on the web, Sun is going to open source Java some day.

Sun is ""months away" from releasing it according to this article:
http://www.infoworld.com/article/...

Possible this can be an oportunity to re-energize the Java development under OS/2, and also to have a solid Java runtime to run all the Java applications available.

so, what do you think ? Lets open the discussion


Subject  :  Re:Sun to open source Java (?)
Author  :  BigWarpGuy
Date  :  01 Jul, 2006 on 19:41
If it is open sourced, it could help OS/2 run those java programs and increase java support for browsers. Porting it could be one item where there is a 'bounty' for it?

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Subject  :  Re:Sun to open source Java (?)
Author  :  eros2
Date  :  02 Jul, 2006 on 07:33
Sources of Java 5 (Tiger) opened for long time, year or more... Java 6 (Mustang) was open source from beginning, Sun release source snapshots weekly - http://download.java.net/jdk6/

Subject  :  Re:Sun to open source Java (?)
Author  :  warprulz daniel.lee.kruse@gmail.com
Date  :  04 Jul, 2006 on 18:52


eros2 (02 Jul, 2006 07:33):
Sources of Java 5 (Tiger) opened for long time, year or more... Java 6 (Mustang) was open source from beginning, Sun release source snapshots weekly - http://download.java.net/jdk6/

I don't know about anyone else, but I don't find the Java Research License (JRL) http://www.java.net/jrl.csp very open source friendly. Particularly these sections:



6. What code is supported under the JRL?

Sun is supporting the JRL for most Java technologies it releases through the Java Community Process as well as research projects surrounding this code.

7. Does this license require a click-through acceptance of terms?

Yes. For enforceability, Sun requires a click-through license.

8. When do I need to get a commercial license?

This research license is only for initial research and development projects. If you decide to use your project internally for a productive use, and/or distribute your product to others, you must sign a commercial agreement such as the Java Distribution License (JDL) and meet the Java compatibility requirements.


Maybe I should restate my comment above as not as open source to what I'm used to seeing. This is open source only on Sun's terms. It's the distribution that isn't open source. What good is open source code without open source distributables, in this case?

From the Java Distribution License (JDL) https://tiger.dev.java.net/JDL_June21_2005_info.pdf



V. FEES. In consideration of the license grants provided herein, You agree to pay Sun the nonrefundable Annual Free, if any, as set forth in Exhibit A. The first Annual Fee payment is due upon the execution of this License by You; thereafter, the Annual Fee is due and payable on each anniversary date of the License. You are responsible for payment of all taxes.

How much does this JDL cost? What does it mean for the OS/2-eCS community? Who would be able to pay the licensing fees?

Golden Code Development (GCD) could get the port done more quickly as they have the 1.4 build system and OS/2 specific code they created that could be brought up to 1.6/6 levels. But they haven't had any clients say they'd pay for the labor and licensing.

The OS/2-eCS community definitely could port the JDK; distribution becomes the sticking point.

Also, 1.6/6 relies on 1.5/5 for bootstrapping. Since we wouldn't be interested in distributing 1.5/5 this is where the JRL would come into play to create the 1.6/6 OS/2 port.

Until Sun changes its JDL to be small community friendly, I'm not seeing how it can be done for OS/2 users. The good news is, under the JRL, we can keep the ports up-to-date until such time Sun does make a small community friendly JDL since the previous version of the JDK is needed to bootstrap.

I wonder, can the class/jar files from either the Windows or Linux distributions be used instead of doing the bootstrap process? Thereby, only building the native executables would only be needed.

Well, lots of issues to think about.


Subject  :  Re:Sun to open source Java (?)
Author  :  warprulz daniel.lee.kruse@gmail.com
Date  :  04 Jul, 2006 on 18:57

BigWarpGuy (01 Jul, 2006 19:41):
<snip>
Porting it could be one item where there is a 'bounty' for it?

Sun's JDK 1.6/6
http://www.os2world.com/cgi-bin/news/viewnews.cgi?category=57&id=1140371343

Apache's Harmony
http://www.os2world.com/cgi-bin/news/viewnews.cgi?category=58&id=1139938951


Subject  :  Re:Sun to open source Java (?)
Author  :  BigWarpGuy
Date  :  05 Jul, 2006 on 14:09
Thank you for the links.

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Subject  :  Re:Sun to open source Java (?)
Author  :  Martin
Date  :  05 Jul, 2006 on 16:13
Possible we should define better what open source is.

What I mean with open source, is releasing the source code under a OSI approved license. (http://www.opensource.org) And not only letting the people see the source code online under a license that may have restrictions.

But there are good links here, I didn't know that there was a source snapshot release available for download.


Subject  :  Re:Sun to open source Java (?)
Author  :  warprulz daniel.lee.kruse@gmail.com
Date  :  13 Jul, 2006 on 15:47

Martin (05 Jul, 2006 16:13):
Possible we should define better what open source is.

What I mean with open source, is releasing the source code under a OSI approved license. (http://www.opensource.org) And not only letting the people see the source code online under a license that may have restrictions.
<snip>


Bingo. There's the rub. Sun's definition of open source is NOT OSI approved. Here's a snippet that refutes its open sourceness:



1. Free Redistribution

The license shall not restrict any party from selling or giving away the software as a component of an aggregate software distribution containing programs from several different sources. The license shall not require a royalty or other fee for such sale.



Maybe it is better said the whole Java distribution from source to getting the package into the wild isn't open source. The JDL is not open source. Now the JRL is. But what good is the JRL outside of an acedemic exercise?

What I wonder is if Sun will "open source" the distribution of the binaries aka the JDL?

It looks like we are in complete agreement now once we get terms defined correctly.


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