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SAMBA for eCS... Need method for complete removal from eCS PC.

Started by NNYITGuy, 2012.01.20, 14:18:03

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herwigb

QuoteYes, the crash is fixed. Now, I get a popup saying that whatever type of share I am trying to mount, is an "unknown mount type". I reply to that popup, and it proceeds to, happily, mount what I requested. There is no evfsgui.err file now. If I try the mount from the New resource tab, I don't get the popup.
Ok, I see what happens, not sure why, but I will fix that, can't be too hard.

QuoteIt seem that NMBD.EXE is starting before the DHCP stuff gets set up
Ok, I never tried that, however I this likely to fail. Eventually code could be added to smb.cmd to wait until DHCP has completed - however, don't expect to see that soon.

QuoteDMB
All you describe here is normal Samba behaviour. The DMB should always be present, in case it vanishes, it might take several minutes for another machine to take over, meanwhile requests will go to limbo - expect loooooong delays in such a situation. There are ways to make sure only a certein machine becomes DMB, this is a matter of RTFM ;-) (look for "os level" setting).

However while I thought over that all, it came to my mind that there's chance to see 2 DMB in the network neighbourhood with current EVFSGUI 2.5 - which is wrong, there is always only one DMB for one domain at a given time - if that changes while EVFSGUI still builds the network neighbourhood, and EVFSGUI already processed the earlier one and later on the new one 2 DMBs will be displayed - I need to think over how to fix that (which wont be trivial).

Just as a side note: Network neighbourhood (called ressource browser) in IBM Peer always was flaky and could easily block the WPS forever....
Kind regards,
HerwigB.

DougB

QuoteOk, I see what happens, not sure why, but I will fix that, can't be too hard.

Hehe. Famous last words...   :)   At least it doesn't crash any more.

QuoteOk, I never tried that, however I this likely to fail.

It depends on how long it takes to get the DHCP information. I see this regularly on my T43 laptop which tries the wired interface first. If that works, it usually doesn't have a problem. However, if it needs to wait for XWLAN to do it's thing, and connect the wireless, it is usually too late. This problem also happens on my machine that only has a wired interface, so it isn't unique to a multi interface machine. There is also a problem convincing EVFSGUI that the interface has changed, when I disconnect the wired, and switch to the wireless. I suspect that this is further complicated if the wired interface was the DMB.

Quotein case it vanishes, it might take several minutes for another machine to take over

It seems to be more like several hours. Even rebooting didn't seem to convince another machine to take over.

Quotemeanwhile requests will go to limbo - expect loooooong delays in such a situation

I think this might be the basic problem that I started with.

QuoteThere are ways to make sure only a certein machine becomes DMB

Since I never know, from one minute to the next, which machine(s) will be on, I don't see how that will help. I do have one machine that is on most of the time, so I will see if I can convince it to be the DMB. I expect that that will help, until I need to shut it down, for one reason or another. I have also been considering making an OS/2 (eCS) based NAS box, with extras. It should be on all of the time, so that may be an answer, but I consider that to be a "work around", not a fix.

QuoteJust as a side note: Network neighbourhood (called ressource browser) in IBM Peer always was flaky and could easily block the WPS forever....

Personally, I have never seen such problems with IBM PEER (but it has been a few years since I tried using it). I also haven't seen a problem where the EVFSGUI Network neighbourhood caused a problem (other than it often refuses to populate, possibly caused by the DMB problem). The hangs that I see are when I try to display the pseudo drive that EVFSGUI creates. I find that the desktop becomes unresponsive, and if I do forget, and do try to do anything else while it is populating the tree (sometimes takes several minutes), the desktop usually stays locked until I force a reboot. It gets better, after the first time it gets populated, but I still have trouble with it sometimes. The really odd thing is that my slow machines have less trouble than my fast machines. I also use RAMFS, which seems to be the basis of the EVFSGUI pseudo drive, and I don't see those problems with it. Of course the RAMFS drive has very little data on it, so it populates quickly, and may hide some of those problems.

FWIW, my brother's setup is only two machines, with a 100 Mbs connection. One is a triple core AMD Phenom on an Asus M3A78-EM motherboard (Realtek 8168 NIC, using the r8169 Multimac driver). The other is an old 450 mhz IBM box, with a Realtek 8139 NIC. His router is a Linksys WRT54G. I got that setup working pretty good.

My own setup is somewhat more complicated, with a Quad core AMD Phenom processor on an Asus M3A78-EM motherboard (using a Realtek 8169 PCI NIC that replaced a defective 8168 on the mb, and using the r8169 Multimac driver). I also have a Lenovo ThinkPad T510, an IBM ThinkPad T43, an antique IBM ThinkPad A22e, and an old Gigabyte 7IXE motherboard, with AMD Athlon processor, using a Realtek 8139 NIC (this one may get retired soon). The machine that I intend to turn into a NAS, is an Asus A8N-SLI motherboard, with AMD Athlon, and NVIDIA NIC. My router is a D-Link DIR-655, which has 1 Gbs wired interfaces. I notice that transferring data over the gigabit interface is rarely any faster than transferring data over a 100 Mbs interface, when using SAMBA (it is very much data dependent). RSYNC, and FTP, work a LOT faster with a 1 Gbs interface.

DougB

Quotelook for "os level" setting

I can find no such thing. Care to give me a hint as to where to find the reference?


DougB

Quote from: DaveS on 2012.06.04, 22:16:11
http://www.samba.org/samba/docs/man/manpages-3/smb.conf.5.html

Thanks. That reads like the fine print in a crooked contract, but it got me to the FAQ (which has a link in the SAMBA server folder). Again. it reads a lot like the fine print in a crooked contract, but suggested using "os level = 40" on the server that I want to be the DMB machine. I tried that, and now it seems that all of the machines think they are DMB (DUMB??). In the following section, it is suggested to also use "domain master = yes". Well, that changed the machine that I want to be DMB to LMB. The other two (that I happen to have turned on), both claim to be DMB. Trying to use the pseudo drive hung the client. It looks like a forced reboot is required. 20 minutes later, it has only a small part of the directory tree displayed, and the only thing that seems to work is Ctrl-Alt-Del, which brings up CADH. All I can do with that is do another Ctrl-Alt-Del, to get it to reboot. At the moment, nothing is updating on the desktop (the clock is frozen, along with everything else).

I also tried to get back to using bcast, but that no longer seems to be working, probably because I have things so messed up that it is confused (I know that I am). I think I will uninstall the whole thing, and start over.

I feel sorry for any non technical person who attempts to get SAMBA to work with eCS. My guess would be that less than 10% of them will be successful, and that would be only because they are lucky enough that the default settings actually work. Even a reasonably technical person (like myself) hasn't got a hope of making it work in most cases. I must admit, that I am not inclined to spend many hours trying to decode the, so called, documentation. It is another example of the *NIX way of having too many options, with most of them having no use, and/or little meaning to the average user.

I am open to suggestions about how to get this mess working. It will be a few days before I get the time to reinstall everything, and then I expect that I will need to start over to find a combination that will actually work reliably. No, I won't leave a windows machine running, just to serve as a WINS server.

RobertM

Quote from: DougB on 2012.06.05, 00:53:49
Quote from: DaveS on 2012.06.04, 22:16:11
http://www.samba.org/samba/docs/man/manpages-3/smb.conf.5.html

Thanks. That reads like the fine print in a crooked contract, but it got me to the FAQ (which has a link in the SAMBA server folder). Again. it reads a lot like the fine print in a crooked contract, but suggested using "os level = 40" on the server that I want to be the DMB machine. I tried that, and now it seems that all of the machines think they are DMB (DUMB??).  

LoL... Domain Master Browser and Local Master Browser. The DMB should be properly storing the collection of all names from all LMBs for lookup and reference, including WINS stuff (which are pretty much simply NetBEUI to TCP/IP resolves which aren't supported by DNS of course). It *should* also be keeping all the LMBs updated with the information it has gathered from all of them.

Quote
In the following section, it is suggested to also use "domain master = yes". Well, that changed the machine that I want to be DMB to LMB.

And thus, that seems very weird.  :-\


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DougB

QuoteDomain Master Browser and Local Master Browser. The DMB should be properly storing the collection of all names from all LMBs for lookup and reference, including WINS stuff (which are pretty much simply NetBEUI to TCP/IP resolves which aren't supported by DNS of course). It *should* also be keeping all the LMBs updated with the information it has gathered from all of them.

I have a basic idea of what it SHOULD be doing. What it IS doing seems to be something else. After a couple of reboots, the machine that I want to be the DMB suddenly decided that it is both DMB and LMB. Still doesn't work very well though, and the other machines still seem to want to be DMB machines.

QuoteAnd thus, that seems very weird.

The whole thing is pretty weird. About the only thing that I haven't tried is to add a WINS configured windows setup. Even if that works, it isn't going to do me much good, because I hardly ever run windows. I suppose that I could run windows in a Virtual PC, but that is flaky enough that I wouldn't feel comfortable using it. I have VBox, but haven't got around to installing windows (or anything else) in it. Of course, I still have the same problem, if I decide to use the physical machine for something else. There is also the load factor, which would probably be unacceptable.

I have an uneasy feeling, that my router is messing around too, but there is nothing obvious in the settings, other than what I mentioned earlier.

melf

I don't want to mess things up, but stress that you are not alone to have problems. I have in particular problems with the "network neighbourhood" function. For about a year ago it worked fine, every computer, every workgroup was found (then we had (in the family) a mix of w2k, vista and eCS computers). Now, no computer, no workgroup is found (now the mix is win2k, w7 and eCS). I can connect using the "new resource" page, i.e. by specifying server, workgroup etc. I don't know if the problem is related to the updates of samba client or to the use of w7 instead of vista. The "network neighbourhood" function is important, especially when you're not at home. Also I have used broadcast as computers are not always on. I now have tried different settings, following this thread. I note that I  now have a lmhosts file in my mptn\etc\samba directory. It lists in fact active computers and their ip numbers, but doesn't seem to make use of that knowledge as the "neighbourhood" is not populated. Ok, I don't need any answers on this, better stick to one case, just adding and pointing to some problems I see.
/Mikael

herwigb

Doug,

try this one http://msplins06.bon.at/~admin139/files/evfsgui-25beta-20120605-debug.zip
The only way I found to trigger your error was to remove the language file, in that case the mount type was not properly initialized, which lead to the behaviour you see.
This EVFSGUI now complains if it does not find a language file and the mount type is initialized with the built in string list from the guy (square brackets around the text in this case).

This is a debug version, please enable debug also in the global settings and paste the complete content of the VX console window to a file and attach that to the ticket.
Kind regards,
HerwigB.

herwigb

Mikael,

QuoteI note that I  now have a lmhosts file in my mptn\etc\samba directory. It lists in fact active computers and their ip numbers, but doesn't seem to make use of that knowledge as the "neighbourhood" is not populated.

The network neighbourhood creates and populates the lmhosts file, which is used by the plugin. The network neighbourhood is not populated by the lmhosts file.

The network neighbourhood is basically a GUI wrapper for the smbtree.exe command. if smbtree.exe does not produce reasonable output, the network neighbourhood will stay empty, too.
Kind regards,
HerwigB.

melf

Thanks for clarification. Running smbtree.exe shows nothing either in fact. But, when using the -N option ("to find out whether [some] table files are actually found or not".) my other computer is actually found.
/Mikael

herwigb

Mikael,

The -N switch is used in many Samba commandline utilities (most notably smbtree.exe and smbclient.exe) to make the command run with guest privilegues only.

smbtree.exe, smbclient.exe and nmblookup.exe are used to gather all the information required in the network neighbourhood.

In case there is a user/pw on the "new connection"-dialog page entered, the commands are run using these, otherwise the commands are run using the -N switch. If you want to make sure the commands are run using -N switch remove user/pw from the "new connection"-dialog page. I know, it's a bit odd this way....
Kind regards,
HerwigB.

DougB

Quotetry this one http://msplins06.bon.at/~admin139/files/evfsgui-25beta-20120605-debug.zip

It still fails, but the message is a little different (and no crash). I updated the incident with what I have had time to do, so far. I also opened an incident for the problem where NMDB.EXE fails to run after a boot. This does not seem to be time related, and I know that the DHCP stuff has been finished long before the problem arises.

Quoteif smbtree.exe does not produce reasonable output, the network neighbourhood will stay empty, too.

It seems that smbtree.exe might need some work. Sometimes, it works okay, but if anything changes (like turning off one of the machines), it seems to go off into it's own little world for a while. Today, while testing, I had three machines running the SAMBA server (IREBBS7, ROAMIN2, and ROAMIN3). When I opened EVFSGUI on ROAMIN2, I saw IREBBS7 and ROAMIN2. When I opened EVFSGUI on ROAMIN3, I saw IREBBS7 and ROAMIN3. No amount of refreshing, or restarting EVFSGUI, changes that. The really odd thing is, that if I restart the server on IREBBS7, all of the machines can see all of the machines. There was nothing, obviously, wrong with the server on IREBBS7.

Far too often, I see that there are more than two SMDB.EXE instances running, for no apparent reason (nothing attached), and when that happens, I generally have difficulty trying to attach one of the other machines. Restarting the server seems to fix that, until it happens again.

I need to mention again, that I see none of these type of problems (including problems when there are more than two SMDB.EXE instances running) when I use windows (XP or 7) as the client, so I am inclined to believe that it is EVFSGUI (possibly just some of the support programs) that is causing the problems.

herwigb

Doug,

try this one http://msplins06.bon.at/~admin139/files/evfsgui-25beta-20120606-debug.zip
I fixed 2 bugs, one in the RPC library (saw that in your log, line 438 etc.) and the second is the sharetype error - this one should be really gone now.

QuoteIt seems that smbtree.exe might need some work. Sometimes, it works okay, but if anything changes (like turning off one of the machines), it seems to go off into it's own little world for a while.
I am not convinced of that (several reasons requiring very lengthy explanations) - I would only do that if a Linux smbtree would perform differently than an eCS smbtree.exe in a given situation. The way the SMB browsing stuff works makes it easy to see breaks like this, especially in case with no permanently present WINS server.

BTW I'd setup os level on your server to 70 or the like. With 40 Samba will loose browser elections against any WinXP machine AFAIR...
Kind regards,
HerwigB.

melf

Quote from: herwigb on 2012.06.05, 20:42:11
//--
In case there is a user/pw on the "new connection"-dialog page entered, the commands are run using these, otherwise the commands are run using the -N switch. If you want to make sure the commands are run using -N switch remove user/pw from the "new connection"-dialog page. I know, it's a bit odd this way....

I can see that (checking the debug square) parameters -S -N i used by the GUI, but nothing in the neighborhood view. However, if I use the commandline, smbtree -N the computer in my network is found.
/Mikael