OS/2, eCS & ArcaOS - Technical > Web applications
FF 38.x - problems invoking from within PMMail
Doug Bissett:
--- Quote --- I'm assuming that PMMail/2 is inserting the //
--- End quote ---
All versions of PMMAil, before version 3.22 (the current GA), are inserting extra forward slashes (including the first one). Firefox always accepted that before, but no longer removes the extra ones, which would seem to be correct operation (it should NOT be changing the URL. I don't know why they were added, and I don't know why Firefox accepted it). Users of older versions of PMMail have three options: 1) continue to use an older Firefox that will accept the extra slashes. 2) use a small script to correct the URL before passing it on to Firefox. 3) upgrade to the current PMMail version (which has a whole lot of other fixes).
For those who haven't noticed, the requirements for a PMMail license is a little different than it was before VOICE moved across the water. See: http://pmmail.os2voice.org/index.php?title=PMMail_for_OS/2 for the details. In both cases, the "payment" method was chosen, to keep costs down, because of banking requirements. VOICE is a non profit organization, and they use the proceeds to support many OS/2 projects (including Firefox).
Andreas Schnellbacher:
--- Quote from: Doug Bissett on January 14, 2017, 07:18:01 pm ---I don't know why they were added
--- End quote ---
Maybe I'm completely wrong, but:
Doubled slashes make sense as long as they are backward slashes. In C (and some other languages) the backward slash is the escape char. Two backslashes were resolved to one backslash in the string. It looks to me as if the doubled forward slashes were created by a lib that is able to convert backward to forward slashes and doesn't recognize the escape char before.
xynixme:
--- Quote from: Doug Bissett on January 14, 2017, 07:18:01 pm ---Firefox always accepted that before, but no longer removes the extra ones, which would seem to be correct operation (it should NOT be changing the URL.
--- End quote ---
Somehow I'm pretty sure that Firefox will change the URL www.xn--andr-epa.eu, and I'm pretty sure that Firefox actually should change the URL www.andré.eu...
--- Quote from: Doug Bissett on January 14, 2017, 07:18:01 pm ---2) use a small script to correct the URL before passing it on to Firefox.
--- End quote ---
A patch to use ^\ instead of // is not tested by me, for one because I don't have a PMMail/2 profile which would eventually call the CMD file or EXE. But also because of the described alternatives. Any of Doug's suggestions is reasonable, and far easier than dirty hacks to repair outdated software.
--- Quote from: Doug Bissett on January 14, 2017, 07:18:01 pm ---the requirements for a PMMail license is a little different than it was before VOICE moved across the water.
--- End quote ---
This very thread clearly shows that too many irrelevant initial changes (like a new owner, and a new requirement, and not enough respect for existing paying "customers") is an excellent way to recude the number of active users significantly. I'm not the only one. Banking (or funding) explains an irrelevant problem, but it doesn't justify anything.
Next time one change at a time is a better idea, unless a change is relevant for a paying customer.
Doug Bissett:
--- Quote ---Somehow I'm pretty sure that Firefox will change the URL www.xn--andr-epa.eu, and I'm pretty sure that Firefox actually should change the URL www.andré.eu...
--- End quote ---
That doesn't make sense. If you tell it to go to www.xn--andr-epa.eu that is where it should try to go. If that page redirects to www.andré.eu it should follow (if allowed). Firefox isn't changing anything.
--- Quote ---A patch to use ^\ instead of // is not tested by me, for one because I don't have a PMMail/2 profile which would eventually call the CMD file or EXE. But also because of the described alternatives. Any of Doug's suggestions is reasonable, and far easier than dirty hacks to repair outdated software.
--- End quote ---
You cannot use \ in place of //. You must use / because this is a URL, which uses forward slashes.
--- Quote ---This very thread clearly shows that too many irrelevant initial changes (like a new owner, and a new requirement, and not enough respect for existing paying "customers") is an excellent way to recude the number of active users significantly. I'm not the only one. Banking (or funding) explains an irrelevant problem, but it doesn't justify anything.
Next time one change at a time is a better idea, unless a change is relevant for a paying customer.
--- End quote ---
You don't seem to know the history. PMMail was purchased from the original authors by BluePrint Software Works (BSW), at one of the v 2.x versions. They did some work on it, to produce the 2.20.2382 version, which was released to previous users (part of the purchase contract). There was also a windows version, at that level. At that time, BSW decided that they would no longer develop the OS/2 version, because the code was a terrible mess. After that, I think they released another windows version, and decided to drop that too. At about that time, VOICE was looking for a bonus for their members, and negotiated a deal with BSW to purchase the OS/2 version (and ONLY the OS/2 version, with a contract that said that BSW retained all ownership to any other version). Then, they could not find the 2.20.2382 version source, and supplied the 2.10 version source (it's a long story). Anyway, James Moe took on the project to get it updated. After many versions where it was mostly code cleanup, PMMail is now much more capable than it ever was before. Some of the problems that were fixed made us wonder how older versions ever worked, at all (and a few things never did work, until he fixed them). Anyway, PMMail v3.x was made available to existing members of VOICE, with an option for new members to pay a nominal fee for it, and all proceeds go toward supporting various OS/2 projects. That is still the case, but the purchase method has changed a little (to reduce the bank charges, which increased the money available to support other OS/2 projects). VOICE, by contract, is not allowed to release the source (although you can get it, if you agree to keep it private, and do some development work). Unfortunately, the only programmer who has really done any work on it, is James Moe, and he has not been able to do much with it in the last couple of years (he does need to make a living, and all development is strictly voluntary), so the project is mostly stalled (but not dead).
So, PMMail 3.x is really a new program, with an old name (there was some debate about calling it VOICEMAIL, but they paid for the name, so they used it). Expecting VOICE to give it away is unreasonable. If you want PMMail 2.x updates, you need to talk to the owner, BluePrint Software Works, which actually doesn't exist any more, and they couldn't release a new OS/2 version anyway (by contract).
xynixme:
--- Quote from: Doug Bissett on January 16, 2017, 08:18:44 pm ---...
--- End quote ---
Whatever...
--- Quote from: Doug Bissett on January 16, 2017, 08:18:44 pm ---So, PMMail 3.x is really a new program, with an old name (there was some debate about calling it VOICEMAIL, but they paid for the name, so they used it). Expecting VOICE to give it away is unreasonable.
--- End quote ---
So far nobody expected that, isn't it?
Back to reality, of marketingchanges: what they should have done is to release a PMMail/2 v3, with hardly more than one change: an (irrelevant) new owner. A fully free upgrade for people whom have just bought a v2 license. Not free for new users. DFSee uses such a strategy, FWIW. After a while they should have introduced PMMail/2 v4, as an upgrade which is as expensive as some VOICE funding constructing. Finally PMMail/2 v5 could have officially merged both systems. Now there were too... many... irrelevant... changes..., and you are still associating former paying customers with being unreasonable (and with wanting v2 upgrades).
--- Quote from: Doug Bissett on January 16, 2017, 08:18:44 pm ---If you want PMMail 2.x updates, you need to talk to the owner, BluePrint Software Works, which actually doesn't exist any more, and they couldn't release a new OS/2 version anyway (by contract).
--- End quote ---
If...
There really is no need to make up what other people want, nor to make up what they are expecting. VOICE has lost a lot of paying customers, by doing in their way, but of course you can ignore that again and conclude that there are no lessons to be learned. Good for you. Back to reality again, apparently many users didn't want PMMail/2 anymore since it was, according to you, bought by VOICE. Too... many... irrelevant ... chances...
And your statements w.r.t. former paying customers aren't making it more attractive. If you've bought DFSee v14.9, then Van Wijk may decide to give you a free v15.0 license. If one has bought "PMMail v14.9", then VOICE's first PMMail v15.0" has always ignored such a situation. Fair enough, as stated earlier. Or, according to you, unreasonable to expect a free upgrade. Different strategies, different results. I, for one, am still using DFSee and I'm still not using PMMail. That's a difference.
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