Author Topic: Is eComStation DEAD?  (Read 45044 times)

Sigurd Fastenrath

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Is eComStation DEAD?
« on: February 01, 2014, 10:36:09 am »
My Software subscription did expire these days. Before I got to prolongue it I am wondering if this is a good idea or not. Spending more Money or looking for an alternative like the - free of Charge - Linux Mint.

So:

When I look back there is almost no Information about

- the "new" owner XEU.COM
- the stage of eCs development
- what is going on at all


in Addition there is almost no activity in the Bug Tracker anymore, when it comes to Mensys or XEU.COM.

Is it time to consider eComstation to be dead?

I am wondering if there is at least one Person around who does know something and is bold enough to write the truth, what ever it may look like.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2014, 12:20:30 pm by Sigurd Fastenrath »

Martin Iturbide

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2014, 01:55:56 pm »
hi Sigurd

The platform had died so many times, that possible asking if it is dead or alive does not make sense.

If IBM, Serenity and/or Mensys are working on a new release should not be our prime focus as a community. Our focus should be to try to move forward on an free (as freedom), independent and open source OS/2 clone. With that we finally put to sleep the question is it dead or alive, since open source software only dies when there are no contributors... and with the option to be resurrected on any time.

The new owner XEU.com has not said anything, so I think it will be good to wait for any announcement or new release before buying a subscription, that is only my opinion.

...just kidding.

But my I think we need a Plan B as a community and stop depending on single companies.
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Greg Pringle

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2014, 03:28:00 pm »
It would seem that XEU bought Ecomstation for business reasons. It would therefore be illogical to immediately dispose of it.
XEU looks to be promoting banking software. Since OS/2 has had a long history in banking it looks like Ecomstation was a strategic buy.

Doug Bissett

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2014, 08:27:31 pm »
Quote
But my I think we need a Plan B as a community and stop depending on single companies.

The problem with that is, that Mensys is currently the only company licensed to do anything with OS/2. I would think that that license would expire if Mensys (or XEU) decided to drop eComStation (unless Serenity still owns the license, in which case it is back in their ball park). Most long time users probably remember the problems with getting that license in the first place. If anything, it will be more difficult this time. It will also be difficult to replace Mensys in the big picture. It has been shown that eCS is not a money maker, and it could very easily become a money sink, so most companies (if not all) would hesitate to get involved, even if the license is still available. I doubt if IBM would allow just anybody off the street to pick it up.

You must also remember, that Mensys is in the business of electronic retail, which includes a LOT more than just eComStation, so it may come down to a business case scenario, which probably isn't good.

Martin Iturbide

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2014, 09:40:08 pm »
Hi

<personal opinion>

- OS/2 first dead was when IBM's Lou Gertstner put in march the strategy to stop investing on OS/2.
- OS/2's second and official dead was on December of 2006 when IBM stopped all support that platform.
- OS/2's third dead was when Serenity System dissapeared, but we have the luck for Mensys to got it.
- OS/2's fourth dead may be on this days that it is moving from Mensys to XEU.
.....I will like to be around for the fifth dead in the future :)

Do we require a company?
I don't know why people think that if it is not a company behind OS/2-eCS we are doom. It is like we have "paradigm" so hard inside us saying that we need big players like IBM, Microsoft, Sony to make the OSes a success. I insist we don't necessary need that. OpenBSD and Linux (kernel) are foundations that maintain their development.

But that does not mean that is bad to have a company behind the OS, and I think that is good to have a company that still sells OS/2-eCS and that bundle it with open source software (Copyleft), so the will be forced to invest on open source bugfixing for the community. I think that is a good retribution for using open source software for commercial use.

But we want to remain in time, and we don't want to depend on a single company or single individual. That's why open source is the path.

Ask yourself this hypothetical question: if Mensys goes bankrupt tomorrow, will you un-install eCS from our system, switch to other platform and stop visiting OS2World at once? or will you remain on the community until you are forced to migrate (lack of drivers, lack of software and .... I don't know... neighbors laughing at you?)

IDEAS
The crazy ideas that shows up as plans, without counting on Mensys and without too much details are:

Option 1 - Keep moving on replacing OS/2 closed source components until we have a full open source OS/2 clone. That will make it legal for everyone to use the clone and will be legal for any company to improve/distribuite/resell it. This is long term.

Option 2 - Use the public OS/2 files (like fixpacks) and recreate some kind "poor's man eComStation", which will be only legal for the people that have an OS/2 license. Create some kind of installer that download the fixpacks files, put it together with the rest of the open source software and create a installable ISO.

Option 3 - Treat everything as abandonware and pray to never get a lawsuit. The problem with this is that we can not grow this way. Abandonware is not understand as "legal to use". Even that there is some kind of legal exception on the US with Abandoware (Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abandonware#DMCA)  it is not enough to make something that can grow and the community will stay as hobbyist toy (which is what is looking today, with the exception that there still some companies that still uses OS2-eCS).


ISPIRATION?

I really think that there a lot of other open source projects that are getting some money and have the collaborative will to keep going without a main company sponsoring them.

1) ReactOS - The already have some VM's, they have supporters and they are starting a Kickstarter campaign to make ReactOS a Cloud OS. They had raises 22K for the moment.

2) Haiku OS, maybe they got source code donation (or not) from BeOS, but they keep moving. Raised 23K for 2013.

3) There are a lot of little OSes being developed and people gave some money to they.

4) OpenBSD which is a more recognized OS, has raised 111K (goal 150K) for 2014. And told that they require 20K only for the electrical bill, while on this community we will kill for 20K that will represent more software/libs ported. (...but even if we found a millionaire to sponsor us, we need a plan)

Just do not say it is impossible, ReactOS is doing it. Just don't say it will take forever, Linux did it and cloned Unix.. and it even became more notorious that moved on replacing Unix.

Action Plan

I insist we need to move on the open source direction and do the following:

1) Build a team of people, developers, testers, documenters, users, supporters and cheerleaders.
2) Build up the plan on how we can reach an open source OS/2 clone.
3) Set the priority on which components to start and which is the effort on each components.
4) Start the fundraising campaign for each component to make this a reality.

If we try to make a 100% clone of OS/2 and we end up cloning only the 70%, 60% or 30% it will still be a success, because we will have more that what we have today.

</personal opinion>
« Last Edit: February 02, 2014, 09:53:52 pm by Martin Iturbide »
Martin Iturbide
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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2014, 11:54:50 pm »
I think you are missing something: IBM owns OS/2 (I will ignore the Microsoft parts). If you include any part of the existing OS/2, in a new distribution, you need a license to do that (Serenity Sytems, or Mensys, has that license today, and I expect that IBM would not allow them to sell it, or even give it away).

Okay, you propose to replace all parts that are still copyright by IBM. The only problem with that, is that you are looking at roughly 100 man years of development to get it all done, and tested. Even if it takes half that time, and you can find 10 developers who are willing to do it, for free, that is 5 years (working around the clock) before anything, except the odd update to the current eCS, for those who already have a license, can be released. 5 years, with no new users (remember that you can only include the stuff that is not part of OS/2), and a loss of those who just can't wait that long, will mean that the user base will be insufficient to support such an effort. Then, there is the question about how long the current PC will exist. I expect that personal devices (tablets, phones, and wrist computers) will replace what we know today, in the near future (5 years). We would also lose a great number of commercial customers, who can't afford to be caught using unlicensed (or even questionable) software. Some of them also require it to pass reliability tests, and other things, so they would be scrambling to find an alternative. They are probably pushing the envelope already, and they likely would not come back.

It is suggested that "Abandon ware" will cover it. I am no lawyer, but I expect that there is a waiting period (starting when Mensys abandons it, and IBM refuses to issue a new license), before it can be considered to be abandoned.

Time is the main enemy, followed closely by the lack of manpower to do the job.

Quote
I don't know why people think that if it is not a company behind OS/2-eCS we are doom.

You have obviously never dealt with IBM. They never really embraced the open source concept, and they are not likely to pay lawyers to clear the way for what you propose. In fact, I am not so sure that they ever got over "the IBM PC is just a toy" concept. If it doesn't make a dollar, they just won't do it. That probably also means that they won't chase an individual, as long as they don't get too carried away, but including copies of an IBM copyright product, with some other package, without paying royalties, forces them to take legal action. If they don't, that would open the doors for anybody to use any of their copyright material, for whatever purpose they like. IBM just can't afford to let that happen.

So, the other option, is to let the user obtain an appropriate version of OS/2, on the open market, then package eCS (I will call it that) as an add on, that does not include the base OS (and that will be completely useless, on it's own). One of the problems could be the availability of fix packs etc. Of course, as the base OS gets replaced, more of it can be included in the new package. After all (or most) parts of the existing OS/2 get replaced, the package will be complete, and the user will no longer need a copy of OS/2 to supply parts that have not been replaced. See my previous time, and manpower, estimates - which are likely on the low side. Meanwhile, time marches on, eCS has gained very little ground, and has probably lost a lot of users, simply because they can't wait for results.

I suggest that we wait, for a while, to see what Mensys or XEU, actually does. It is likely that no decisions have been made, yet, and we should get some sort of statement from them, when a decision is made.

I see three possible scenarios:
1) They will just shut down eComStation, and remove it from internet access.
2) They will shut down eComStation, and make the project available to the public (that may depend on what the contract with IBM says).
3) They will continue as it has been.

If 1), we will need to start over from the beginning.
If 2), somebody will need to pick it up, and run with it. No small feat, and there would be a learning curve to deal with.
If 3), we still have the same problems that we have today.

So, it won't hurt to try replacing parts of OS/2. Some have already been done, but finding someone who would even consider doing the job has proven to be difficult, and a lot of them would want to keep their work closed source. I don't see that starting with the WPS would be a good idea. It is too big, although XWorkplace is a probably a good start. Parts like the TCP stack would make more sense, but that is pretty specialized. CMD.EXE has a replacement in 4OS2, but there are incompatibilities that need to be addressed (perhaps that would be a good place to start though). There are a lot of drivers that could be tackled, but we desperately need new drivers for new devices, and that is proving to be more work than expected, so old device drivers that still work, get ignored. It seems that OS2LDR and OS2KRNL, are under way, and have been for some years, with some success, even with the questions about the legality of the OS4 project.

I guess we need a priority list, that can be picked by those who are willing, and able, to do the job. Some of that has been tried on OS2world, with minor success. Mensys has picked up some of the very important things (ACPI, AHCI, Multimac, Firefox), but there is much more that needs to be done, and soon. Paul Smedley has been looking at Multimac, but there are a few problems to sort out, and he certainly doesn't have the time that is necessary. At the current rate, I figure that 100 man years of work, will take close to 300 years to get it all finished.

Again: Time is the main enemy, followed closely by the lack of manpower to do the job.

Martin Iturbide

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2014, 12:34:07 am »

I think you are missing something: IBM owns OS/2 (I will ignore the Microsoft parts). If you include any part of the existing OS/2, in a new distribution, you need a license to do that (Serenity Sytems, or Mensys, has that license today, and I expect that IBM would not allow them to sell it, or even give it away).

An OEM agreement with IBM is not impossible. Serenity did it on the past, and IBM will love to get money without costs just like they did with eComStation. But you it will be required to make an interesting offer to IBM and find the right contacts. Also, any other OEM company will have to make a commitment in sales and pay to IBM.

If you include any part of the existing OS/2, in a new distribution, you need a license to do that ...
Not necessary. You can create an OS/2 distro without including OS/2 files with a trick.

Crazy idea - Option 2: It can be possible to create a installer that will download IBM files Warp 4.53 fixpack 3 and other and will create an ISO installer for the user. You will not be distributing IBM's files. But that is a crazy idea I don't want to do, it just an idea.
You have obviously never dealt with IBM.

Doug, this are the comments that I want to try to avoid on the forum. Making assumptions on the other. I remember that once I was called "Linux Hater" because I did not liked Linux file system structure implemented on OS/2 RPM, while I like Linux. I worked for IBM for 9 years, I know IBM.

IBM is out of the consumer market and OS/2 is no longer a preferred choice for servers. IBM will only work with a business case and this community or making OS/2 Open Source does not have a business case.  I don't know why when I say "Let's make an open source clone of OS/2" everything thinks that "IBM should allow that", or "IBM will not allow that". IBM does not care about this community because we are not a market for them. IBM is out of the discussion, we are not going to hear from them. (but maybe we should send a letter to Ginni  ;D )

Watching it as 100 man years maybe right. But looking it into smaller pieces to show progress will create traction and show movement outside this community. And also make more people join to help.

Maybe it is wrong to start with WPS, but just imagine if we send a news outside that says: "50% of WPS is open source now !", or "40% of Presentation Manager had been cloned"... that will bring more notability to the community and will  bring more people to help.

I remember that ReactOs was only promoted by Russians on the early years. Now I saw that it has many American contributors, talking on events, showing the software, asking for help, to join, etc.... why we can't do that? they are not genius? they do not have unlimited time or resources? but they have pulled a decent Win32 clone to start with. 

I had seen very good atempts to clone OS/2 in the past, but they keep trying to make everything at the same time, PM, SOM, KERNEL, WPS, MMOS2. So the idea will be to only focus on one components, finding developers for it, and raising money to help.  The components may run stand alone or over eCS, I really don't care, as long as it is open source to allow derivative works.

Presentation Manager?
SOM?

4OS2 can also be good to replace cmd. It will be a good exercise to see what happens if we replace cmd complete with 4OS2, what is missing? what will stop working?
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Martin Iturbide

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2014, 01:21:37 am »
Crazy idea - Option 2: Or make an installer that uses Warp 4.52 CD/ISO as a requirements like UpdCD, that will create a new ISO image.
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Doug Bissett

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2014, 04:09:31 am »
Quote
An OEM agreement with IBM is not impossible. Serenity did it on the past, and IBM will love to get money without costs just like they did with eComStation.

There were others who tried earlier. I think that Serenity got it simply because they knew somebody in IBM who was high enough in the company to make it happen. Whether that would, or could, happen again, is highly questionable. Beside that, Serenity may still be the ones who hold that license. That is not clear.

Quote
create a installer that will download IBM files Warp 4.53 fixpack 3

Technically pretty simple, but you still need a license to distribute OS/2 to do it.

Quote
Maybe it is wrong to start with WPS, but just imagine if we send a news outside that says: "50% of WPS is open source now !", or "40% of Presentation Manager had been cloned"... that will bring more notability to the community and will  bring more people to help.

40 or 50% of anything is not going to accomplish much. What good is 50% of a car? You need to start small, with something that can be done, in a reasonable amount of time, and if that attracts enough attention perhaps others will start to help. As I noted, CMD.EXE is relatively small, and a lot of the heavy lifting has already been done. 4OS2.exe does work pretty well, but there are a few incompatibilities that need to be addressed, before it can be called a replacement for CMD.EXE. Start there, and see what happens. Other things that could be done:
ATTRIB.EXE, DISKCOMP.COM, DISKCOPY.COM, EAUTIL.EXE, LABEL.COM, MODE.COM, and MORE.COM. Some of them already have replacements, but they are all part of the big picture.

Quote
Or make an installer that uses Warp 4.52 CD/ISO as a requirements like UpdCD, that will create a new ISO image.

That is essentially what Mensys does. The problem is, that you still need the license for OS/2. If IBM stops selling those, you need to depend on the used market, to do it legally, and, you still have the same old problem about supporting newer hardware. It is not impossible, but it would be very difficult to get that idea off the ground, before too many users leave the game. If this project had been started, the day after IBM announced that OS/2 was "dead", you might have had a chance of pulling it off. Even Serenity, and Mensys, may have started too late, and they had a few corporate dollars to support it. To make matters worse, there are a lot of OS/2 users who have refused to support eComStation, but still seem to think that they should have access to all of the goodies that have been created. Mensys has done a great service to the OS/2 community, and they have made most of what they did available, but they do need to have some reason why users would pay them to do those things, and that ends up supporting further development, along with a couple of people who actually coordinate the whole thing.

Now, assuming that Mensys/XEU does pull the plug, we need a strategy that will show results, almost immediately, just to keep the users that are still here. Then, that strategy needs to expand, as quickly as possible, until there are enough interested, capable, people, to actually start to tackle some of the bigger parts that will take longer. Whether it can be done, remains to be seen, but starting with the WPS, and announcing that you have 50% of it (if that is even possible), after two years, is not going to do what you hope for, especially if we still don't have WiFi support.

Dream big, but start small, if you want to succeed.

Sigurd Fastenrath

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2014, 08:46:09 am »
It is obvious to me that nothing will change nor will I get a serious information from Mensys / Xeu.com.

Just look at the "anual" discussion last year:

http://www.os2world.com/forum/index.php/topic,69.msg467.html#msg467

It was just a retorical question as the answer is at hand.

But from what the reality looks like nothing happens and as expected the may be new owners are or the ones in charge are not interested in the community, they just want to sell as much eCS as they can. And this is to fit the needs of industrial clients and not waste time with community things.

The conclusion to me is (and was already before I started this thread): eCS is dead for the community.

For those answering:

- we have to wait for the next release and see what.....
- in the next near furture there will be feature... release....

Just go to the records (e.g. above) during the last 3 years.

I would like to see an OS/2 clone come alive, but I doubt this will happen (unfortunately).

I only wonder why none of the developers - wich are in contact with Mensys or who ever - do still keep quit. May be they are forced to as one of the parts of their contracts.  :-X

My intention with this was just to say "Wake up."



« Last Edit: February 03, 2014, 04:07:51 pm by Sigurd Fastenrath »

Andi B.

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2014, 12:15:20 pm »
Quote
I only wonder why none of the developers - wich are in contact with Mensys or who ever - do still keep quit. May be they are forced to as one of the parts of their contracts.
A simple answer maybe they do not have the time/do not want to wast their time in reading and answering all these forums/groups. But of course I can't speak for them.

Another thought I want to add here in the thread - IMHO the OS/2 - eCS community is special compared to others in the way what they expect from there system/apps. An average Linux guy usually tries things out, plays with software, read numerous hours in the net about problems he encounters and sometimes even start to improve the sources. An average OS/2 - eCS guy expects perfect software focused on the task he needs to be done. Without problems, without incompatibilities even to his own brewed centuries old messy hacked scripts ;)

The average eCS guy don't even tell the maintainer about bugs at least not when it comes to fill a ticket and trying to nail it down to reproducibly test case. Yes I know we have some prominent exceptions to this this rule here.

So IMHO it does not make sense to have 50% WPS replacement. You need 99.999%. 99.9% is way to less for being acceptable to the average eCS user. At least that's what I see with the here in this thread mentioned 4os2  ;)

Doug Bissett

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #11 on: February 03, 2014, 06:00:06 pm »
Quote
It is obvious to me that nothing will change nor will I get a serious information from Mensys / Xeu.com.

Unfortunately, that seems to be a result of trying to do a project on a "shoe string" budget. You, and the rest of us, don't get much information, because they aren't even sure about what is going on. They have also learned, finally, that it is best to shut up, until there is some concrete news to tell. Too many times their announcements have failed to materialize. Then, they seem to have ONE guy who does most of the English communication, and he was sick for a while (I hope he is not sick again, we never heard about that, until after the fact).

Quote
And this is to fit the needs of industrial clients and not waste time with community things.

The "industrial" clients are the ones who have been keeping it going. Without them, there would be far less money to work with, and that would mean far less paid development, which would mean that the platform would become unusable even faster. It has always been that way.

Quote
The average eCS guy don't even tell the maintainer about bugs at least not when it comes to fill a ticket and trying to nail it down to reproducibly test case.

This is true, but it also works the other way around. Some of the maintainers seem to expect that only those who can fully debug a problem should have the right to report problems, and they can get very nasty when somebody attempts to report a problem, without the proper supporting documentation (which they usually have no idea about, and maintainers don't want to tell).

Quote
So IMHO it does not make sense to have 50% WPS replacement. You need 99.999%. 99.9% is way to less for being acceptable to the average eCS user.

Actually, it would need to be about 110%, to keep OS/2 users happy. OS/2 started out as an OS that was supposed to be "perfect" (as all the rest claimed). Overall, when IBM was developing, and maintaining, it, it was about as good as it got, and users came to expect that it would be near to "perfect", and if there was a problem, somebody else would report it, and the next fix pack would fix it. The only thing that has changed, is that IBM has been replaced by a dozen, or so, freelance programmers, who are often working without source code, to try to keep it going, never mind make it "perfect". The users still haven't figured out that those programmers need all the help they can get, and part of that is that users need to learn how to properly report problems, and then do the report themselves, because it seems that others aren't going to do it. As noted above, maintainers need to be more user friendly, and patiently explain to a user what they need to know, and how to collect the proper data for a problem report (instructions should be part of the distributed package, and some actually do that). True, that takes away from the time that they are far too short of, but after a while, (some) users will start to catch on, and better reports will be available.

Perhaps that is part of the answer. Before even thinking about cloning any part of OS/2, the users need to have a course in how to properly report problems, and, it would be good to have a group of users, who do have some idea, screen those problem reports, to be sure that they have the information that is required, before it goes to the maintainers. This group could also create instructions, and tools, to be placed in the packages.

jdeb

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #12 on: February 03, 2014, 08:31:12 pm »
My Software subscription did expire these days. Before I got to prolongue it I am wondering if this is a good idea or not. Spending more Money or looking for an alternative like the - free of Charge - Linux Mint.

I think you would like Slackware better Sigurd, with all your technical ability. Mint is super easy but Slackware is rock solid stable. In my opinion, the most stable release of Mint is Mint Debian "Rolling Release" followed by Mint 13 Maya (LTS).

Neil Waldhauer

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #13 on: February 04, 2014, 12:32:31 am »
I don't think it's dead. The new ACPI and driver fixes in eCS 2.2 beta 2 allow easy installation on machines that were out of reach a year ago. This beta is only a few weeks old, and there are a few large pieces to add before the next beta.

Not many people work on eCS business, so they likely have to choose between talking about working, and actually working. I expect we'll find out soon enough how things will go with eCS.
Expert consulting for ArcaOS, OS/2 and eComStation
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Sigurd Fastenrath

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Re: Is eComStation DEAD?
« Reply #14 on: February 04, 2014, 07:38:37 am »
I don't think it's dead. The new ACPI and driver fixes in eCS 2.2 beta 2 allow easy installation on machines that were out of reach a year ago. This beta is only a few weeks old, and there are a few large pieces to add before the next beta.

Hi Neil,

yes, the latest USB and ACPI has been a good progress, but meanwhile the hardware platform did move forward as well. So we do have hardware that was not supported a year or more ago but actual hardware is not supported on a reliable way:

- UEFI is a show stopper for a lot of modern hardware
- WLAN - a key feature - is not supported
- Sound is not working on most of modern hardware wich has an HDMI output as well, because there are two soundhardwares then that can not (as far as my experience lead me to) be handeld by UNIAUD
- USB 3.0 is not at hand (Laptops with USB 2.0 stopped to be produced for some time now; some have the possibility to use 3.0 as 2.0 (like my X230t); even most of the now common mainboards miss USB 2.0 support)
- do not want to mention all the other things like Bluetooth, Firewire, Graphic support, outdated LAN support (thanks to Paul there might be some movement here)
- Memory hole at 512 MB and and and

-> therefore for serious, reliable work one have to cut Laptops, Tablets and all portable devices. Whats left are Desktop PCs.

I try to build a maximum warp PC for some time now. As I found a good combination (ASRock 990FX Extreme4 Mainboard, AMD FX 8 core CPU, CMedia 8738 Soundcard and Nvidia 6600 PCie Grafic card) even this has so many limitations with eCS.

And on the other hand - there would be almost NO information about eCs on modern hardware if there would not be a handfull users from the community wich report from time to time.

And again - what is really a joke to read (not adressed to you!) is the argument "The 'developers' - wich is wrong - I mean the Distributor! (misleading post of mine, sorry!)  have to work instead of reading forum news/questions" - that's really something I can not believe being argumented with! It brings tears in my eyes (   :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(  )    ::)

I do KNOW that the ones in charge are reading the forums and taking profit from the reports and tips and tricks on hardware given here - but they do not have 2 minutes to answer - Come on - on wich planet do we live??

I.e. look at the memory hole at 512 MB - for me I mentioned it first while playing around with the Samsung Series 7 Slate in 2011/2012. I do know from answers of "Someone" from that time that this was mostly new for them. I then "presented" one possible solution: using OS4Loader. And Yes, I got a message then that they are working on a solution. Some months later the developer of OS4 Loader mentioned, that someone tried to download his sources.....

I.e. 2: In 2009 I tried to install eCS next to Windows 7. The messages from "some" I got then has been: "This is impossible with OS/2 Bootmanager". As it turned out to be possible as I proofed it (and others as well) I got some new messages from there. Oh man.....

I.e. 3: eCs 2 beta 5 : I was able to test it as one of the first persons - and discovered, that it destroyed my HDD layout. Same goes later on, a beta was released with missing mouse support and so on and so on. That does not look like being tested "on more than 90 PC inside Mensys" - except this PCs are dated till 2002..; the eCs 2.2 beta 4 with that painfull ecs.ru "Modern ui" that disabled i.e. the Drive letters.....

I do not want to show how "Glorious and great I am" - this are just facts to demonstrate why I have so much trust in the "distributors team" there. Just look at ACPI - as long at is has been developed by ecs.ru this was a PITA - it simply did work only on a handfull PC - and did i.e. kill one of my X200t graphic chips due to overheat.

It just changed when (only to mention a few) David, Steven, Lars, Silvan, Herwig, Wim - and of course you, Neil, Doug and others stepped in. Unfortunately they have not enough man power and even if working very hard can not catch up with the hardware demands. We are not talking about a "100% OS/2 or eCS" - it would be nice to have rudimental support. I do have very much respect for their work!!! And I would like to thank them again!!

But, when it comes to Mensys or Xeu.com or whatever - with their policy those are ruining everything the others try to keep alive.
And without the help and testing and reporting of the community - it would have stopped some years before.

P.S: I removed colours and bold.

It is important for me to divide between the "active developers" (wich are making a very very good work!!) and Mensys/xeu.com as the "Organizer/Distributor" (wich in my opinion do make a very bad job).




« Last Edit: February 04, 2014, 09:36:44 am by Sigurd Fastenrath »