Author Topic: Multiple installations of AOS?  (Read 1789 times)

Andrew Stephenson

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Multiple installations of AOS?
« on: August 30, 2023, 03:34:17 pm »
This is my newbie post to the Forum, so please excuse dropped clangers.

Way back, around the Dawn Of Humanity when IBM was marketing OS/2, their legal paperwork included text that could be reduced to: "We don't care how many machines you install a copy of OS/2 on, if only one is in use at any one time."

Is this still true of AOS?  My hope is to use a desktop machine for work (mainly fiction writing with scraps of 'C' programming), keeping a notebook as emergency backup (once purged of Windows 10).  If materials must be moved between them, I can use USB sticks, thereby keeping only one m/c in use at a time.  Does this count as legal and ethical behaviour?  Or must I invest in 2x AOS-5.1?

Eugene Tucker

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2023, 03:44:35 pm »
This is not effective in OS/2's current version of Arca OS. Read their license. I think I have read that it was an error in the original OS/2 license. But it says what it does.

Andrew Stephenson

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #2 on: August 30, 2023, 08:56:47 pm »
Thanks, Eugene.  I had a quick snoop around for the legal conditions but failed to find them.  Am I missing the woods for all those trees?

Dave Yeo

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2023, 11:53:07 pm »
it shows up during installation, close to the beginning and won't let you proceed until you scroll to the bottom. So boot from your stick, choose install and then read the license, then cancel the install.
I read it in detail before 5.0 was released and it did say one install and Lewis verified I was reading it correctly, so legally you can't do what you'd like. Ethically, it is your choice, very doubtful that any lawyers will come for you.

Andrew Stephenson

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2023, 03:05:00 pm »
Thanks, Dave...  If the T&C paperwork only comes with AOS-5.1, that could explain my inability to find it, as I have yet to buy.  (A layered story, awaiting developments.)  Perhaps Arca Noae's Secret Masters could put those T&C on their website?  And consider allowing the sort of  limited secondary use I described?   Either way, I'd rather play by the rules -- not doing so feels like irresponsibly writing buggy Life Code.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2023, 03:06:35 pm by Andrew Stephenson »

Martin Iturbide

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2023, 07:26:45 pm »
Hello.

Is this document what you are looking for?

https://www.arcanoae.com/wp-content/uploads/wiki/ARCAOS_5_0_EULA_v1_0.pdf

This seems to be for version 5.0, not sure if it was updated or if it the same for 5.1.

Regards
Martin Iturbide
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Andrew Stephenson

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2023, 11:20:56 am »
Hello.

Is this document what you are looking for?

https://www.arcanoae.com/wp-content/uploads/wiki/ARCAOS_5_0_EULA_v1_0.pdf

This seems to be for version 5.0, not sure if it was updated or if it the same for 5.1.

Regards

Aha!  To semi-quote the Sheriff in "No country for old men": if it isn't, it'll do 'til one comes along.  Many thanks.  In fact, it looks like no specific release of AOS is covered by that document, simply the Product in general, a sort of rolling permit. 

Indeed, Clause 3 may cover my need.  Ie (edited): "3. License Grant  [...]  Arca Noae grants you a nonexclusive license to 1) use the Product up to the Authorized Use specified in the PoE, 2) make and install copies to support such Authorized Use, and 3) make a backup copy, all provided that: a. you have lawfully obtained the Product and comply with the terms of this Agreement; b. the backup copy does not execute unless the backed-up Product cannot execute; c: [...]"

My purpose is to keep the notebook m/c as a backup lifeboat, for when the main (work) m/c conks out.  How  we ensure only one of those m/cs otherwise executes at any one time is a puzzler, beyond AN trusting to honesty.

Then there is the question of whether I need the Personal or Commercial AOS.  If I, a sole person, write a novel and flog it to a publisher (hey, one can dream), that's commerce, right?  But if AOS helps make a communicable form of the novel from a version previously fashioned in my mind...?

Do we need (eg) a USB key which, while plugged in, lets the AOS on that m/c function?  Hope not: sounds ugly.

Life's complicated.  *sigh*  Help appreciated, people.

Roderick Klein

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2023, 01:38:33 pm »
This is my newbie post to the Forum, so please excuse dropped clangers.

Way back, around the Dawn Of Humanity when IBM was marketing OS/2, their legal paperwork included text that could be reduced to: "We don't care how many machines you install a copy of OS/2 on, if only one is in use at any one time."

Is this still true of AOS?  My hope is to use a desktop machine for work (mainly fiction writing with scraps of 'C' programming), keeping a notebook as emergency backup (once purged of Windows 10).  If materials must be moved between them, I can use USB sticks, thereby keeping only one m/c in use at a time.  Does this count as legal and ethical behaviour?  Or must I invest in 2x AOS-5.1?

At Mensys I worked on the EULA license text.  You are allowed to install OS/2 only on one system or Virtual machine. This goes back to the OS/2 EULA.
You are allowed to make as many backups as you want. But you are not allowed to install on multiple PC's.
Best i can tell the same applies to ArcaOS. I understood at a Warpstock Arca Noae its agreement with IBM also ties them to the OS/4 Warp 4 EULA.

In the eCS license text an error slipped that I had written. It was intended to read you are only allowed to use more then 3 personal licenses of eCS.
This can also be read that eCS can be installed on 3 systems (personal version). But this is NOT correct.


Roderick


Alex Taylor

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2023, 01:48:42 pm »
Then there is the question of whether I need the Personal or Commercial AOS.  If I, a sole person, write a novel and flog it to a publisher (hey, one can dream), that's commerce, right?  But if AOS helps make a communicable form of the novel from a version previously fashioned in my mind...?

I'm not speaking for Arca Noae, but...

TTBOMK, "commercial" use of software means any of:
  • Using the software as part of running a business (whether incorporated or not)
  • Using the software to directly earn income (e.g. doing consultancy on it, reselling it as part of an integrated product, etc.)
  • Using the software to support an income-generating infrastructure (e.g. using it to develop commercial software, running an income-generating website on it, etc.)

Your novel question gets into fuzzy territory.  If you use word processing software to write a novel, which you then publish and earn income from, that would likely count as commercial use of the word processor.  Anything at a further remove from the activity is more ambiguous IMO.  Does it count as commercial use of the OS you run the word processor on?  (That isn't quite the same as the developing-software example above, because most likely neither the word processor nor the published novel depend on that particular OS to function.)   Commercial use of the computer you run the OS on?  Commercial use of the home where the computer is located?  Commercial use of the electricity you use to power the computer?  I think the answer to all of those is "maybe, but it depends".

Maybe a simple rule of thumb would be to use your local government's definition of what qualifies as a business expense.

Some interesting (though not very conclusive) discussion on the topic.  There isn't really a cut-and-dried answer.
https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/12642/how-is-commercial-use-of-software-defined

Martin Iturbide

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2023, 02:25:47 pm »
Then there is the question of whether I need the Personal or Commercial AOS.  If I, a sole person, write a novel and flog it to a publisher (hey, one can dream), that's commerce, right?  But if AOS helps make a communicable form of the novel from a version previously fashioned in my mind...?
Hello

I may have a different view of this. If Andrew haven't receive any monetary compensation to write the novel, is not commercial use yet. At the moment he finish his novel and get a monetary deal with a publishing house or publish his book for sale at Amazon (with or without a publisher), at that moment he need to switch his license to commercial.

Yes, it is fuzzy territory, but there is big difference between "potentially getting a million dollars for a unfinished novel" and actually getting it  ;D

Regards
« Last Edit: September 01, 2023, 10:18:11 pm by Martin Iturbide »
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Eugene Tucker

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2023, 02:57:17 pm »
I personally have two licenses, and I am planning on a third. Since there is not a license or key install involved it is totally on your ethics and morality. It is important to realize that it is important for Arca Noae to keep developing.

Olafur Gunnlaugsson

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2023, 03:12:07 pm »
In the eCS license text an error slipped that I had written. It was intended to read you are only allowed to use more then 3 personal licenses of eCS.

This can also be read that eCS can be installed on 3 systems (personal version). But this is NOT correct.

Did you mean 5?

"eComStation 2.1 versions:
eComStation 2.1 is released in two flavours:

The Home & Student version can be used by any private or small office user. As a private or small office user, it is allowed to have up to 5 licenses installed for production usage. This version includes 6 months of Software Subscription Services.

If more than 5 licenses are needed, it is required to purchase the Business Edition. The Business Edition includes 12 months of Software Subscription Services. Volume discounts are available for the Business Edition."

Roderick Klein

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2023, 04:36:02 pm »
In the eCS license text an error slipped that I had written. It was intended to read you are only allowed to use more then 3 personal licenses of eCS.

This can also be read that eCS can be installed on 3 systems (personal version). But this is NOT correct.

Did you mean 5?

"eComStation 2.1 versions:
eComStation 2.1 is released in two flavours:

Sorry I wrote that text about 12 years ago when I still worked at Mensys. It was intended to READ if you want to use MORE then 5 license you need to buy a commercial license.
It NEVER intended to imply you can use eCS personal license in upto 5 devices at the same time. Thats a violation of the OS/2 EULA.

Roderick

The Home & Student version can be used by any private or small office user. As a private or small office user, it is allowed to have up to 5 licenses installed for production usage. This version includes 6 months of Software Subscription Services.

If more than 5 licenses are needed, it is required to purchase the Business Edition. The Business Edition includes 12 months of Software Subscription Services. Volume discounts are available for the Business Edition."

Olafur Gunnlaugsson

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #13 on: September 02, 2023, 04:58:21 am »
Sorry I wrote that text about 12 years ago when I still worked at Mensys. It was intended to READ if you want to use MORE then 5 license you need to buy a commercial license.
It NEVER intended to imply you can use eCS personal license in upto 5 devices at the same time. Thats a violation of the OS/2 EULA.

Roderick
I know, I was not wondering about the license useage, but about the number 3 vs 5
« Last Edit: September 02, 2023, 05:00:17 am by Olafur Gunnlaugsson »

Andrew Stephenson

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Re: Multiple installations of AOS?
« Reply #14 on: September 02, 2023, 03:07:20 pm »
Thanks, everyone, for your collective ponderings on the Personal/Commercial question.  It got quite chatty there; maybe we are all lawyers-manque.  :-)  Looks like I must simply bite the bullet and buy Commercial, if that lets me install AOS-5.1 on main and lifeboat machines (or must I buy 2x Personal -- I'm lost).  Supporting AN/AOS is a worthy cause.  Having had to acquaint myself with latter-day Winspit (in its #10 incarnation), I can attest there are worse fates than paying a few tuppences extra for quality.