Author Topic: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help  (Read 12707 times)

Martin Iturbide

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Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« on: June 12, 2014, 03:11:55 pm »
Hi

I will like to know if someone is interested in helping me with an OS/2-eCS Supported Hardware site based on OS2World Wiki.  I know that someones are in favor and other against a Wiki, but that is all I got to have a collaborative way to create a "Supported" hardware list for this platform.

I got Jonas Buys permission to republish his site contents on the OS2World Wiki and reposting his content very slowly. So, I need a little hand with this.

The Wiki is here: http://www.os2world.com/wiki/index.php/Category:Hardware

I'm organizing it in a different way:
- The first column (Computers, Hardware Devices and Adapters) are lists (tables) of the supported devices. On that list each device can have its own wiki page link if it is necessary.
- On the second column, on Drivers, I want to have a list (tables) of the device drivers for each category.
- On the second column, on Tools, There are links to the Tools descriptions
- On the third column In want to link the general information that used to have the OS2Warp.be site.

You can access OS2Warp.be on the archive.

Let me know if there is interest about improving this Wiki area. Currently I'm not discussing to have an alternative to a Wiki because I can not create a "database site" and I want all the documentation to be Creative Commons, but help is welcome.
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Eugene Gorbunoff

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2014, 06:27:43 pm »
As you can see, the users don't send Hardware reports.

Only a company which is working with Hardware (or writing drivers for OS/2) every day is able to collect information. Sort it, clean, Read forums, bug-trackers and collect bits of information.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2014, 07:16:17 pm by Eugene Gorbunoff »

ivan

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2014, 09:12:21 pm »
Martin, a couple of observations from me wearing my engineers hat.

Contrary to what Eugene says ordinary people will contribute if you make it simple for them to do so. 

Your average person is, generally, not into editing a Wiki page usually because they are not sure what is wanted.  There is a way to bypass that but it requires that whoever controls the Wiki does the actual editing based on e-mailed reports from users.

To do something like that it would require you to produce templates (something like the hobbes readme.template but in much greater detail) that people can download, fill in and e-mail back.  You would also need to provide some indication of the types of information you needed as well as how to obtain it if necessary (see the problem.txt provided with Dani's drivers).

I can say the above does work because I setup such a system at a large engineering plant so their service department a) knew what equipment had problems and b) also knew what replacement parts were most probably required (my consultant fees were paid for in the first 6 months of operation by reduced down time costs).

If you want to discuss in more detail e-mail me, my registered e-mail works.

dbanet

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2014, 11:10:23 pm »
To do something like that it would require you to produce templates (something like the hobbes readme.template but in much greater detail) that people can download, fill in and e-mail back.

Oh, that is pain. If I were a user (well, I am), I wouldn't do anything like that.

A simple HTML form is much much better than a text template that is needed to be sent to an e-mail address...

ivan

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #4 on: June 12, 2014, 11:43:02 pm »
Boris, not everyone is using their computer with the browser open all the time and it a lot easier to use a simple text editor to get your information down and checked first, especially if it need such things as the output of PCI.EXE, RMVIEW etc.

An HTML form might work for simple add in cards, USB adapters etc but howmany pages would you need to give full information about a motherboard?  Especially where you need to note the changes that need to be made to the BIOS to get it to boot, what order the HD controllers need to be in etc.

Your idea would work if all that was needed were responses like 'works', 'takes some time to set up', 'sound not working' or 'sound only works with xyz driver'.   

Martin Iturbide

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2014, 12:31:57 am »
Sorry, I was not clear.  If you want to have "something", you can help me port the OS2Warp.be site to the OS2World wiki and have it's content under Creative Commons.  Otherwise, it is only good intentions. 

Please if anybody wants to help just join the Wiki with the same userid and password of this forum.

Regards
Martin Iturbide
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Martin Iturbide

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2014, 12:44:17 am »
Look, in ten minutes I got a decent draft of moving this article to the wiki.

http://www.os2world.com/wiki/index.php/PCI.EXE:_A_powerful_sniffing_utility
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ivan

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2014, 02:19:56 am »
Sorry Martin, I was under the impression that you not only wanted to import the .be site but also to increase the amount of hardware that will run OS/2 eCS by getting information from the users of that equipment.

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2014, 11:33:30 am »
Boris, not everyone is using their computer with the browser open all the time
Really? I'm pretty sure we should aim at the other 99% of users, Ivan.

and it a lot easier to use a simple text editor to get your information down and checked first, especially if it need such things as the output of PCI.EXE, RMVIEW etc.

An HTML form might work for simple add in cards, USB adapters etc but howmany pages would you need to give full information about a motherboard?  Especially where you need to note the changes that need to be made to the BIOS to get it to boot, what order the HD controllers need to be in etc.

Your idea would work if all that was needed were responses like 'works', 'takes some time to set up', 'sound not working' or 'sound only works with xyz driver'.   
Do you want users just to send the PCI.EXE output? Wow, that's easier to do with a web browser too!

If you don't quite understand: that wouldn't be hard to parse the PCI.EXE output on client's side (JS) and dynamically prepare the corresponding amount of additional forms for each device outputted by PCI.EXE for the user to leave a comment to each of them.

No, seriously, a text template?

ivan

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2014, 01:02:25 pm »
Boris, we will have to agree to differ on that but in my 50+ years in IT and Engineering I have found that keeping it as simple as possible works better but YMMV.

dbanet

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2014, 02:11:30 pm »
YMMV
Ivan, I think if Martin gets ready to provide a hardware compatibility report service, a plain text template to be sent to an e-mail address might still have be an optional alternative.

my 50+ years in IT and Engineering
Do not really help in arguments.

keeping it as simple as possible
As simple as possible for the user, not for the developer.

Eugene Gorbunov is having troubles with his hardware compatibility db just because the UI is not quite... er-r... had been worked out...

Martin Iturbide

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2014, 03:58:14 pm »
Hi Ivan.

I think that your suggestion of making templates with the Wiki is good. I'm trying to refresh my knowledge with MediaWiki templates.

I had created a Driver template for example:

Check out the Wiki source of this page: http://www.os2world.com/wiki/index.php/Webcam_Device_Drivers
I think it will be easy to put a driver in this format that making the users create a table.

Let me think more about the rest.
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Martin Iturbide

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2014, 04:29:03 pm »
What do you think?

THis:

Quote

==USB==
{| class="wikitable sortable" border="1"
|-
! Brand !! Name !! Model !! Chipset !!Port Type !! Driver !!Comments
|-
|Logitech || Logitech C250 Webcam  || || ||USB||[[Webcam Device Drivers#USBECD.SYS|USBECD.SYS]] ||
|-
|Chicony || Chicony Integrated Camera  || || ||USB||[[Webcam Device Drivers#USBECD.SYS|USBECD.SYS]] ||
|-
|Ricoh|| Ricoh Integrated Camera  || || ||USB||[[Webcam Device Drivers#USBECD.SYS|USBECD.SYS]] ||
|-
|}

Vs. this

Quote
==USB==
{{HWList
|Device=

{{HWItem
|Brand=Logitech
|Name=[[Logitech C250 Webcam]]
|Model=
|Port=USB
|Chipset=?
|HardwareID=?
|Driver=[[Webcam Device Drivers#USBECD.SYS|USBECD.SYS]]
|Comment=Working}}

{{HWItem
|Brand=Chicony
|Name=[[Chicony Integrated Camera]]
|Model=
|Port=USB
|Chipset=?
|HardwareID=?
|Driver=[[Webcam Device Drivers#USBECD.SYS|USBECD.SYS]]
|Comment=Working}}

{{HWItem
|Brand=Ricoh
|Name=[[Ricoh Integrated Camera]]
|Model=
|Port=USB
|Chipset=?
|HardwareID=?
|Driver=[[Webcam Device Drivers#USBECD.SYS|USBECD.SYS]]
|Comment=Working}}

}}

Is it the same thing?

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Joop

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #13 on: June 13, 2014, 07:11:34 pm »
I think its a good plan, but I'm not sure if the .be site is interesting because lots of stuff is not in the shops anymore. Now we can deal with older hardware due to the nature of our drivers, but how far back are you going with older hardware?
Did looked at the site, found already a missing group ;-), can I add that? And where do you add that group?. Its a tablet as replacement for the mouse from Wacom.

The Russian site is not clear enough and not in the proper language, always difficult if you working worldwide, so no blame to the owner.
 
I think that four or five fields will do with a remarker field for if some chip on a motherbord is not supported or does the wrong things. I agree with others that it must be simple for adding. If all of us can just do that will also include the danger that some "os/2-haters any form" can do that, only with other intensions. So how are you going to solve that question?

Doug Bissett

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Re: Supported Hardware Wiki - Request for Help
« Reply #14 on: June 13, 2014, 07:59:08 pm »
Quote
The Russian site is not clear enough and not in the proper language, always difficult if you working worldwide, so no blame to the owner.

That is one of the reasons why I quit updating that site, but more important is that if I get a new device (Lenovo ThinkPad L530, for example), I would have had to mark it as "Poor", because there was missing support for memory above 512 meg (it has 4 GB), and the Realtek NIC did not work. Both problems have been resolved, so now the rating should be "Good", or even "Excelent", but there is no way, that I can find, to change that rating. All that I can do, is add a note that it has been resolved, and the rating should now change.  A casual observer would never bother to read all of the notes that change the rating. All they will see is the "Poor" rating. I also don't want to bother finding web pages that refer to the device. Most of the time, they really don't apply anyway. A user can google for that information, if they care.

The main problem with all of the hardware rating sites, is that they get old, and it can be difficult to determine if a device is currently available, or 10 years old, and "out of stock". I don't know of a good way to resolve that problem.

Quote
I agree with others that it must be simple for adding.

Absolutely required. It should also be easy to change things, as the situation changes.

Unfortunately, as noted, there are people out there who can't seem to control the urge to destroy things. Using the OS2WORLD logon helps, but that can still be misused (as seen in the forums sometimes), and a lot of damage could be done, very quickly. Perhaps, there could be a list of "known" users, who can post without review. Others would need to have their posts reviewed, before changes are made. The person who does the review could decide to add the poster to the white list, leave them unrated, or banish them. That will be a LOT of work, for somebody, for a while, but probably not as much work as cleaning up a mess.