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Messages - Martin Iturbide

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1
Hello Alex

Quote
some years ago, a student hired by NMSU had a bad day and re-invented how files should be named at Hobbes.
It was not a student, it was me and it didn't took a "bad day", it took several "bad years" (sarcasm).

We discussed in this forum the Hobbes reorganization for some years. There was the problem that several drivers were called os2warp.zip, os2.zip and you have no idea what the file was about by reading it.

Long story short (with a lot of discussion) I documented the "Upload File Naming Convention - 100% optional From Martin Iturbide". I didn't came up with that kind of standard, I just saw it in some other files and took that one.

As it say, it is 100% optional. The important thing is to keep uploading new software to Hobbes.

Regards

2
Programming / Re: Brainstorm: OS/2 on a Different Kernel
« on: Today at 06:08:27 pm »
Hello
Some days I wonder if the best thing that could happen to that kernel is a leak of it and the default drivers set.
There was already a leak of the source code of the Warp 4 (not 4.5) kernel. I personally don't have the skill to know how useful is the source code. The issue is that it had fired in the past the discussion if it is legal or not to use it.

According the some people, the OS4 Russian Team created derivatives of the kernel with this leaked source code.... more discussion.

Also we have Arca Noae that as a formal commercial agreement with IBM and those kind of agreements you are required to protect the intelectual property of IBM.

About the leaked source code I guess it is only legal under the 107 article of the US copyright law, which limits a lot the commercial use of it.

So, I don't know  ;D ;D ;D ...we discuss it a lot and the ideal thing (long term) will be that IBM releases the source code or to build an open source clone.

Regards




3
Web applications / Re: Dooble releases, Qt5 builds
« on: July 07, 2025, 09:54:00 pm »
Hello Dave

Thanks for the port. Here on the ArcaOS 5.1.1 VM seems to be working fine.

Regards

4
Virtualization / Re: Win-OS/2 - Open vbesvga.drv video driver
« on: July 03, 2025, 11:48:28 pm »
Quote

Release builds, yay!

Repository: PluMGMK/vbesvga.drv · Tag: v0.7.9 · Commit: a9bb1cf · Released by: PluMGMK

For the first time, I'm shipping non-debug builds of all driver components!

The setup instructions remain the same, but now instead of supplying separate loose files, I've zipped them all up in the vbesvga-release.zip file. Everything in that zip file can be copied to C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM as part of the installation. For v0.8.0 I'm hoping to have a streamlined setup process too.

The vbesvga-debug.zip file contains two folders: relsyms with symbol files for the release builds, and debug, with debug builds and corresponding symbol files, for use with WDEB386. If you just want to use the driver, you don't need any of these files.

Other changes:

    Finally fix display corruption in bluescreens when running under VirtualBox
    Proper execution of screen-to-screen blits with pattern ROPs
    Add a BounceOnModeset configuration option to allow tuning the behaviour when starting a windowed / background DOS box (see here for more details) – yes, this is a config change, but I didn't want to bump to v0.8.0 until I improve the installation process (so I compromised by going to v0.7.9)

At this point, I'm pretty happy with the driver's stability, since it seems to get through the WinTach, WinBench and WinStone test suites without any crashes or misbehaviour!


This release has 4 assets:

    vbesvga-debug.zip
    vbesvga-release.zip
    Source code (zip)
    Source code (tar.gz)

Visit the release page to download them.

5
Applications / Re: [Looking] Info about MS LAN Manager
« on: July 03, 2025, 08:28:34 pm »
Hi Thomas
Not sure if this is of any interest to you.
I own an IBM OS/2 LAN Server for Macintosh Version 1.01 (german Version).

Please feel free to post images of the box, the diskettes, the contents and any part numbers that you may found on it. I will also include it on the OS2World wiki.

Regards

6
Applications / Re: General Software Testing
« on: July 03, 2025, 08:26:37 pm »
Hi

Just in case I put some screenshots here:
- https://www.os2world.com/wiki/index.php?title=Champion_for_OS/2

Now that I see it better, looks very similar to Legato, and Legato is is from MicroBurst. I'm guessing this is the Japanese grandfather of IBM Works.
- https://www.os2world.com/wiki/index.php?title=Legato

Regards

7
Applications / Re: General Software Testing
« on: July 02, 2025, 06:01:32 pm »
Hello

I found on some old online CD's "Champion for OS/2" which seems to be a Japanese IBM Works/Office alike software.
Seems to belong to IBM, MicroBurst and MetaSoft. Does anybody remembers if this was freeware or commercial?

Regards

8
Programming / Re: Brainstorm: OS/2 on a Different Kernel
« on: July 02, 2025, 05:48:44 pm »
Hello jmase. It is good to see you around.

I don't have answers, just opinions  :D

What do Haiku OS, OpenBSD, Redox OS, ReactOS (and so on) have in common? They are opensource.
And they all have a active development community.
Just as FYI:
- HaikuOS (Microkernel)uses "NewOS kernel" developed by Travis Geiselbrecht. Travis worked on the BeOS kernel, Haiku OS Kernel and now he is working at Google in the FuchsiaOS project (Possible on the Zircon Kernel)
- ReactOS (Microkernel) has  the "ntoskrnl" which is a kernel to be compatible with the NT Kernel.
- Redox OS (Microkernel) has a kernel made in rust.
- OpenBSD (monolithic)
I agree, if it is open source it has a better change to survive over time.

Quote
Opensource could make it interesting for people to look how it was made, get new people interested
in creating a modern (64bit) OpenOS/2.
You all know I'm a supporter of Open Source since a lot of time. Open source allowed us to keep using OS/2 today, we had took a lot of the Open Source community. It is not for me as "Open = Good" and "Close = Bad", it is more like "Open = Better", since it is better to have the source code and binaries instead of only the binaries.

Quote
Maybe a petition to IBM to opensource what they can would work now, so many years has passed...
(or ask them if the leaked sources can be used ;)
I am tempted to request it again to IBM, this time Arvind Krishna, the OS/2 sources, or partial sources, the OS/2 PowerPC source,  permission for the leaked source or even a license change to the IBM device driver kit source code that can be open source friendly... anything. But it is possible that we did not get a reply or something similar of the last time with Sam Palmisano, but you know the expression " ‘No’ is Guaranteed ", so what can we loose asking again?

Quote
The kernel used should be the Linux kernel, not that its a great kernel but its actively developed, supports almost all hardware and there are tons of people who knows how it works. Implementing support for things like 16bit apps on a modern OS is not easy,
but using a really well known kernel with loads of developers would help.
I always loved the "Microkernel" idea and even the "Workplace OS" idea. I even think that the Android fragmentation problem was in part because of the Linux monolithic kernel (accompanied with the manufacturers that were so profit oriented and didn't want to compile new versions on the old devices). But I have to agree that the Linux kernel is widely used and possible the best option. I think it is the best shot because there is more knowledge of that kernel in general.

Regards

9
Programming / Re: Brainstorm: OS/2 on a Different Kernel
« on: June 30, 2025, 11:27:41 pm »
Thanks Igor for the link. I didn't know that Valery wrote those articles.

I know that Yuri Prokushev and Valery worked a lot on the OSFree project, but I was never able to translate their progress to try to send news to the community. I was hoping that OSFree can do some little progress and generate software things that the OS/2 community can use, so they can gain recognition and move forward to the final goal, but it didn't happen.

The idea of using the L4 Microkernel was great, but maybe we need more popular kernel like the Linux one. My idea of using Zircon is just a wild shot brainstorming since I want a Microkernel too.

Regards

10
Article Discussions / Re: Games with older SDL and FSLIB
« on: June 30, 2025, 04:27:05 pm »
Hello Dave.

Thanks, it worked here putting the /share folder in "/usr/local/". It is working fine, windowed and full screen, sounds work and I think that controls and speed are fine.

Just wonder if it can be more easy to the user like having the .exe and the directories on the same folder to ship it in a simple way in the package. I'm attaching the picture of the older build for an idea.

Regards

11
Programming / Re: Brainstorm: OS/2 on a Different Kernel
« on: June 30, 2025, 04:02:14 pm »
What is now left to do is to persuade ChatGPT to write the code for you.
I'm waiting for that AI tool  ;D ;D ;D

12
Article Discussions / Re: Games with older SDL and FSLIB
« on: June 30, 2025, 05:42:22 am »
Hello Dave

Thanks for giving it a try.
In my case I have a problem that can not found the menu.ogg file. (error attached) I tried located the files in different paths and I can not make the .exe find the files. Is there something I'm missing?

Regards

13
Article Discussions / Re: Games with older SDL and FSLIB
« on: June 28, 2025, 07:42:52 pm »
Thanks Dave

Seems to be working fine here.

Do you see that "Amoebax" is also compilable? It uses also zlib , libpng, Ogg, Vorbis

https://github.com/OSSGames/GAME-SDL-PUZZLE-Amoebax

Do you use automake for the ones that have "Makefile.am" ?

Regards

14
Article Discussions / Re: Games with older SDL and FSLIB
« on: June 28, 2025, 05:25:35 pm »
Hello

I contacted the Alizarin Tetris author, because the page says that latest version is 1.0.7 and the source code there is for version 1.0.6.

She replied:

Quote
Martin,

Thanks for letting me know.  It seems this page wasn't updated correctly, and enough time has passed that I'm having trouble finding the files locally.  I recommend working with version 1.0.6.  The main  change for 1.0.7 (which you can duplicate) was to avoid buffer overruns by changing calls to sprintf() to instead use this macro, added to atris.h:

atris.h:#define SPRINTF(buf, fmt, args...) snprintf(buf, sizeof(buf), fmt, ## args)

I hope this is helpful!

        Kiri

It is not a big change, I guess.
Regards

15
Programming / Re: Brainstorm: OS/2 on a Different Kernel
« on: June 28, 2025, 03:32:16 am »
Is the FuchsiaOS Starnix component the same as developing a Developing a Compatibility Layer (Personality)?

That's an excellent and insightful question. You've hit on a core architectural component of Fuchsia that is directly related to your project goal.

**Yes, the FuchsiaOS Starnix component is a specific, real-world example of a "compatibility layer" or "personality."**

Let's break down the relationship:

* **Compatibility Layer / Personality:** This is the general, architectural term for a layer of software that translates the API and ABI of one operating system to another. It's a broad concept. The OS/2-on-Zircon layer you're imagining is a personality layer.
* **Starnix:** This is the **concrete implementation** of a compatibility layer for the Linux ABI on top of the Zircon kernel.

So, Starnix is not just *like* a compatibility layer; it *is* one. It's a perfect case study for your project.

### How Starnix Works (and how it's relevant to your OS/2 goal)

Based on the information available and the design goals of Starnix, here's how it functions:

1.  **User-Space Implementation:** Starnix is not part of the Zircon kernel itself. It's a user-space component, which is a key principle of the microkernel design. This is different from a monolithic kernel where a compatibility layer might be integrated into the kernel.
2.  **ABI Translation:** Starnix acts as a **syscall translator**. When a Linux binary (an unmodified one) running on Fuchsia makes a Linux system call (e.g., `open()`, `read()`, `fork()`), that call is intercepted. Starnix then translates that request into one or more Zircon syscalls and/or IPC messages to other Fuchsia services.
    * **Example:** A Linux program calls `read()` on a file descriptor. Starnix intercepts this, figures out which underlying Fuchsia VFS (Virtual File System) component corresponds to that file descriptor, and then sends a message to that component via a Zircon channel to perform the read operation.
3.  **No Kernel Modifications:** The goal is to run Linux binaries without modifying the Zircon kernel. All the complex logic for Linux compatibility lives in user space within the Starnix component. This makes the kernel more secure and stable, as the compatibility layer's potential bugs are contained.
4.  **Emulation of User-Space Concepts:** Beyond just syscalls, Starnix has to emulate a lot of Linux-specific concepts that don't exist in Zircon's native world, such as:
    * **File Descriptors:** Managing a table of file descriptors for each process.
    * **Filesystem Layout:** Providing a `/dev`, `/proc`, and other Linux-style virtual filesystems.
    * **Process and Thread Semantics:** Replicating the behavior of `fork()`, `exec()`, signals, and process groups.
    * **Networking:** Translating Linux network socket calls to Zircon's network stack.

### Analogy to Your Project

Your proposed **OS/2 Personality Layer on Zircon** would be the Starnix equivalent for OS/2.

| **Concept** | **Fuchsia/Linux World** | **Your Proposed OS/2 World** |
| --------------------------------- | ---------------------------- | ---------------------------- |
| **Microkernel** | Zircon                       | Zircon                       |
| **Compatibility Layer / Runner** | Starnix                      | Your OS/2 Personality Layer  |
| **"Untouched" Binaries** | Linux binaries               | OS/2 binaries (LX format)    |
| **System Call to Translate** | Linux ABI (syscalls)         | OS/2 ABI (`Dos*`, `Win*`)      |
| **Source Code for Reference** | Starnix Source Code          | OSFree, 2ine, OS2Linux source |

**In short, studying the Starnix source code would be a brilliant way to learn how to approach your OS/2 project.** It's a living, working example of exactly the kind of architecture you need to build. You can see how they intercept system calls, manage state, and translate requests from one ABI to another.

The challenges you would face would be similar, but for the OS/2 ABI instead of the Linux ABI:

* **Understanding the ABI:** You need to map every OS/2 system call to Zircon primitives.
* **Emulating Behavior:** Replicating OS/2's memory model, IPC, and resource management.
* **Building User-Space Services:** Creating an HPFS filesystem driver and other services that integrate with Zircon.

The Starnix component is proof that this architectural approach is feasible for running unmodified binaries on a microkernel like Zircon. Your task would be to do the same for the OS/2 ABI instead of the Linux ABI.

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