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Public Discussions => General Discussion => Topic started by: badre on May 18, 2021, 01:28:57 am

Title: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: badre on May 18, 2021, 01:28:57 am
Hi,
I have an IBM thinkpad T42 1.70ghz 1.5gb ram, I tested the demo cd 2.2 beta 2, it does not work, I have a black screen, I tested the demo cd beta 5 and it works very well,
is it possible to buy the eComStation 2.2 version, I believe that the final version does not exist, the last one is beta 5, it seems to me,
 or do I have to buy the eCs 2.1 version and then upgrade days in 2.2 beta 5?
I haven't tested eCs 2.1 demo cd version because I couldn't find it.
Thans in advance.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Dave Yeo on May 18, 2021, 03:08:01 am
eComstation seems to be dead and no longer for sale. What you can do is buy ArcaOS from Arca Noae, https://www.arcanoae.com (https://arcanoae.com), which is the successor to eComstation with many of the same developers. Highly recommended. No demo unluckily due to their license from IBM. They also offer very good support, in case of problems and it works well on my T42. Note that for the T42, APM support should be used instead of ACPI. With APM everything works on my T42 except hibernation (might also work if installed on C:)
BTW, welcome to the forum.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Martin Iturbide on May 18, 2021, 04:04:22 am
Hi badre, welcome to the forum.

I also suggest you not to buy eComStation, because it is not longer updated. ArcaOS is being actively developed and supported. It will save you a lot of time on putting OS/2 Warp 4.52 (or eComstation) up to date with the latest DLLs libraries and software that is available for the platform.

It can be also a nice exercise to install OS/2 Warp 4.52 on your T42 first, but I think you will be happier with ArcaOS.

Regards
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Ibrahim Hakeem on May 18, 2021, 04:59:38 am
Seconding Martin's quote here:
Quote
It can be also a nice exercise to install OS/2 Warp 4.52 on your T42 first, but I think you will be happier with ArcaOS.

It's not a bad idea to tool around with OS/2 Warp 4.52, but definitely avoid Ecomstation and go straight to ArcaOS, especially since you are already committed to spending the money on a new license. I'd personally recommend upgrading to something like a T61 or T400 if you intend on using the OS/2 platform for a longer period of time however.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Dave Yeo on May 18, 2021, 05:50:39 am
One advantage of the T42, at least mine, is working WiFi. Firefox (or SeaMonkey) take forever to start but then mostly work fine here. Not quite good enough for YouTube but close.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Andi B. on May 18, 2021, 10:08:42 am
Quote
...on my T42 except hibernation (might also work if installed on C:)
Hibernation works on my T42p (some eCS DE Version installed on M:). What you need is a C: Partition which is configured to hold the hibernation file(s). But it's not worth to install all this old stuff. I think I've posted somewhere the time it takes to hibernate. IIRC something about 1:40 while a reboot takes nearly the same time. It's so slow although I've put into a SSD in my T42p.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: badre on May 18, 2021, 11:40:48 am
thank you for your information, i will go to arcaos,
i also installed os / 2 4.52, which works well, i just have problems for the usb, concerning the usb floppy drive.

For ArcaOs 5, all drivers is included ? i need separed packages ?
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Martin Iturbide on May 18, 2021, 02:57:30 pm
For ArcaOs 5, all drivers is included ? i need separed packages ?

Hi, that is the idea of ArcaOS, to have all possible included. It has the USB drivers, ACPI driver, and a lot more software included on the installer directly. Version 5.0.6 is the latest version available.  You can check some of the changelogs.  (https://www.arcanoae.com/wp-content/uploads/wiki/ArcaOS-changes.txt)

Regards
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Neil Waldhauer on May 18, 2021, 03:53:18 pm
I sell eComStation. I can sell you the final beta build eCS b2 2.2 (Dec 31) for the price of eCS 2.1. eCS Demo beta 5 is based on eCS 2.2 beta 2 from May, 2013.

Others have said ArcaOS is a much better idea. For your case, I agree with them. If you buy eCS b2 2.2 (Dec 31, 2013), it is pretty much unsupported. You are on your own.

ArcaOS 5.0 was less feature rich than eCS 2.2 b2 (Dec 31), but with the current ArcaOS 5.0.6, it is much better than any eCS.

https://www.blondeguy.com/computer/eComStationForSale.html (https://www.blondeguy.com/computer/eComStationForSale.html)

The only case where eCS is better is where you have a product based on eCS and you want to buy a license for one more copy of your product. In that case, ArcaOS is not acceptable. I have tried, but Arca Noae will not accept the order. As such, my largest accounts are eCS-only.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: badre on May 18, 2021, 06:51:16 pm
@Neil Waldhauer eCs2.2 beta 2 not work on my ibm thinkpad T42 but eCS2.2 beta 5 work.
i think its better that i buy arcaos 5.0.6 which should work on my thinkpad T42.

For the purchase I suppose it is an email with the link that we received (digital download), because in DVD, shipping is expensive to France.

I can burn the iso file with imgBurn to DVD.
The last version for ArcaOs is 5.0.6 ?
ArcaOS work with pcmcia card ? is not limited with ibm pcmcia card, for example with DWA-610 d-link ?

If i want to boot from floppy drive usb it work ? is exist disquette for booting to c:\ prompt with ArcaOs ? because with os/2 warp 4.52 it not work
causing usb drivers, when i insert the third diskette , it not recongnize floppy drive.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Ibrahim Hakeem on May 18, 2021, 07:02:04 pm
@Neil Waldhauer eCs2.2 beta 2 not work on my ibm thinkpad T42 but eCS2.2 beta 5 work.
i think its better that i buy arcaos 5.0.6 which should work on my thinkpad T42.

For the purchase I suppose it is an email with the link that we received (digital download), because in DVD, shipping is expensive to France.

I can burn the iso file with imgBurn to DVD.
The last version for ArcaOs is 5.0.6 ?

If I'm not mistaken, once you've made the purchase you will then be able to click a link to have an ISO generated for you through your orders page on your Arca Noae account. When the ISO is ready, you'll get an email notifying you and it's smooth sailing from there. I can verify that imgBurn will work just fine as I've used it to burn ArcaOS ISOs. I'm pretty sure there's even the tools to make a bootable USB in the package from Arca Noae, but I'd personally recommend going with burning it to a DVD since that option is much more straightforward.
From personal experience, when I had a T42 - I noticed that using a DVD burnt beyond 8x speed seemed to not work reliably. I'm not sure if this is a universal thing or just due to the condition of my drive, but it's worth keeping in mind.

Regarding PCMCIA cards, I don't have any knowledge on this when it comes to ArcaOS, but I'd have to assume so long as you've got the relevant drivers for whatever card you're trying to work with, it shouldn't be too much of a problem. If you are installing a DWA-610 for the sake of having WiFi, your internal card on the T42 should already be compatible. I think the XWP addon for wireless connectivity already deals with the hard stuff. Just to be clear, this addon is included.

As for USB floppy drives, I believe the feedback is mixed on them due to how many options there are with their own varied controllers. Your mileage may vary. You won't need to boot from a floppy drive to install ArcaOS though, it's bootable from the DVD drive.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: badre on May 18, 2021, 07:13:20 pm
thank you for all informations.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Dave Yeo on May 19, 2021, 02:41:49 am
Yes, as Ibrahim says, after purchase, they will build a personalized ISO image for you to download.
You can burn it to DVD or build a bootable USB stick or even put it on a special HD (small FAT) partition to install. You shouldn't need a USB diskette drive but booting should work.
For maintenance, which I assume you tried to boot the diskettes for, you can use the burned DVD or USB stick, there's an option to leave the installer to a maintenance desktop.
As for PCMCIA cards, they should be supported given the drivers.
The latest current version is 5.0.6 with 5.1 in the pipeline, assuming it is released in the next 6 months, you also will be able to download that. As well as any driver updates that have been done since the release of 5.0.6.
As for the actual install, here I found I had to deselect the AHCI driver for the install to finish, it is not needed, you may find the SNAP video driver better on your system.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Neil Waldhauer on May 19, 2021, 03:45:05 am
The latest current version is 5.0.6 with 5.1 in the pipeline, assuming it is released in the next 6 months, you also will be able to download that.

You will be able to download 5.1 if you pay for it. If there is a 5.0.7, that is included in the support and maintenance agreement.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Greg Pringle on May 19, 2021, 02:16:54 pm
So, Neil, you say Arca Noaea does not have re-sellers?
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Neil Waldhauer on May 19, 2021, 03:16:47 pm
So, Neil, you say Arca Noaea does not have re-sellers?

I am an Arca Noae reseller. You can buy ArcaOS from me in digital download, DVD, USB stick, virtual machine, and pre-loaded on laptops, towers and desktops.

http://www.blondeguy.com/computer/BlueLion.html (http://www.blondeguy.com/computer/BlueLion.html)
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Wendy Krieger on June 08, 2022, 01:45:54 pm
ecS 2.2 only went to beta.  But it's still very good.  Buy 2.1 and use its key in the 2.2 beta.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Eugene Tucker on June 08, 2022, 02:36:51 pm
The problem with ECS as you will have to get the driver support from Arca Noae. eCS does not seem to be in development any longer. If yo want a future capable OS yo need Aara OS. Which the coming 5.1 will be able to install on a UEFI machine and wil also support Nvme drives and GPS.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Andreas Schnellbacher on June 08, 2022, 02:38:04 pm
For Hardware since about 2016, you need newer drivers than the ones in eCS 2.2 beta 2 + latest CVS additions.

For example, I always had problems with the USB drivers from the eCS times with a board from 2015. Newer systems can't even be installed without recent drivers. But due to the limited contiguous memory amount, the maximum of usable hardware is about at i5. (About 1 GB recognized memory with newer systems is too little.) Usually the RAM for a built-in video driver uses a part of the recognized RAM. Consider that and eventually use an additional video card instead.

In your case, it's a very old T42. That one is supported by Warp 4.x, eCS and Arca OS. Compared with more recent hardware, the T42 is quite slow. At least replace the HD with a SSD. Don't expect the system to work with newer Web sites. I would start with newer hardware.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Roderick Klein on June 09, 2022, 02:05:59 pm
I am testing a system here with UEFI firmware (1 year old) and I have 3.3 GB of RAM. It depends on the system.

Roderick
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Lars on June 09, 2022, 04:42:28 pm
You will never know how much of system memory (RAM) is mapped below the 4 GB physical address line.

Newer systems tend to reserve a lot of the physical memory space below 4 GB presumably for the PCI(e) bus so that you can use older 32-bit PCI cards/devices, potentially requiring large amounts of physical address space (like, say a 32-bit PCI graphics card with 2 GB of video memory: it needs 2 GB of physical address space below the 4 GB address line). Newer 64-bit PCI cards are of course not suffering from this problem.

It's just a fact that every modern OS is 64-bit by now, which means, it has no problem accessing system memory if it is mapped to physical addresses beyond 4 GB and therefore it is not affected by this limit. And therefore manufacturers no longer care about this limit.

Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Dave Yeo on June 09, 2022, 05:44:29 pm
You will never know how much of system memory (RAM) is mapped below the 4 GB physical address line.

Booting in UEFI mode, you will know how much memory is mapped below 4GB, though there is sometimes problems with fragmentation and not being able to use it all. One problem with the newest systems is starting to be having the video buffer mapped above 4 GB, which makes the system unusable to OS/2.
I used a system with 1.5 GB's of ram at one point, no SSD or ram disk and it wasn't too bad. Generally the stuff that got swapped out wasn't used much and it was only things like linking xul.dll that brought the system to its knees. Once ran out of memory and swap so learned not to have SeaMonkey running when building Mozilla. Swap file has a 2 GB limit, I guess due to signed ints.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Lars on June 10, 2022, 10:48:04 am
You will never know how much of system memory (RAM) is mapped below the 4 GB physical address line.

Booting in UEFI mode, you will know how much memory is mapped below 4GB, though there is sometimes problems with fragmentation and not being able to use it all. One problem with the newest systems is starting to be having the video buffer mapped above 4 GB, which makes the system unusable to OS/2.

1) Yeah. Once you have bought your new computer you can then check if it works with OS/2. Unless you find someone beforehand that has the very same computer and also uses OS/2. Great deal.

2) "Video Buffer above 4 GB (physical address line)" is a perfect example of PC manufacturers no longer even considering 32-bit OSes, left alone 16-bit OSes. It would have been a better choice if AN had accepted this fact and would have become more involved with the Virtual Box team to ensure that OS/2 will continue to run virtualized. But they decided differently.


I know one thing for sure: if my fairly old desktop computer dies, I will move away from OS/2 altogether. I already do all current development under an eCS guest running under Virtualbox.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Neil Waldhauer on June 10, 2022, 03:27:20 pm

1) Yeah. Once you have bought your new computer you can then check if it works with OS/2. Unless you find someone beforehand that has the very same computer and also uses OS/2. Great deal.


If you look at http://www.blondeguy.com/ComputersForSale.html (http://www.blondeguy.com/ComputersForSale.html), I list some computers that work pretty well with ArcaOS. You don't have to buy them from me. I supply the information you would need to configure BIOS and install ArcaOS. I plan to continue this after ArcaOS 5.1 makes UEFI systems available. I expect Arca Noae to solve the video above 4 GB technical issue eventually.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Dave Yeo on June 10, 2022, 04:55:58 pm
There's also the option of taking a USB stick set up to install 5.1 with you and testing if it'll boot to the maintenance desktop and doing a mem /v
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Lars on June 11, 2022, 08:31:14 pm
No. Either you know somebody that lends you the USB stick that has ArcaOS 5.1 on it or you will have to buy ArcaOS. And we are back to zero.
Title: Re: eCS 2.2 purchase
Post by: Roderick Klein on June 16, 2022, 10:44:10 pm
You will never know how much of system memory (RAM) is mapped below the 4 GB physical address line.

Newer systems tend to reserve a lot of the physical memory space below 4 GB presumably for the PCI(e) bus so that you can use older 32-bit PCI cards/devices, potentially requiring large amounts of physical address space (like, say a 32-bit PCI graphics card with 2 GB of video memory: it needs 2 GB of physical address space below the 4 GB address line). Newer 64-bit PCI cards are of course not suffering from this problem.

It's just a fact that every modern OS is 64-bit by now, which means, it has no problem accessing system memory if it is mapped to physical addresses beyond 4 GB and therefore it is not affected by this limit. And therefore manufacturers no longer care about this limit.

Testing ArcaOS 5.1. beta (I am on the tester team) I have seen systems where all PCI devices have 64 bit MMIO addresses (I had one of these laptops). The UEFI loader remaps these back to 32 bit MMIO address ranges. Now the video card could be an issue using a lot of memory below the 4 GB. However more and more video cards have something called PCI bar resizing. This *might* help de amount of reserved RAM be reduced. When I have such a laptop I will test again and see if that is indeed the case.

Roderick Klein