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Messages - Roderick Klein

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1
Networking / Re: RTL8211CL DRIVER
« on: Today at 01:07:54 am »
1. Dump the output to os2world.com of pci -i dump.txt. Presto.

2. Good luck with that old driver Ben.  Realtek had bad habbit of releasing many chipset revisions under the same chipset ID. Resulting in older drivers no longer working.  You could consider buying an Arca Noae OS/2 and eCS drivers and subscription for 49 Dollars.

But first check If you have your PCI id from PCI.EXE you can see if the chipset is supported by the Multimac drivers:
https://www.arcanoae.com/wiki/multimac/

Roderick

2
Article Discussions / Re: OS2VOICE RPM Server
« on: February 20, 2018, 11:46:25 pm »
Roderick, using your Tame example are you saying that there would be just ONE rpm file that contains EVERYTHING necessary for running Tame with a USB scanner or would we need to download several rpm files?

If it is the first then a simple WPI, like the original Tame distribution should suffice and the WPI database would also be updated.

If it is the second then we are seeing a basic change to OS/2.  By that I mean using rpm is forcing a file system layout that is foreign to OS/2 to try and work with the basic OS/2 file system so things may or may not work depending on the bldlevel of the various components.

In engineering we tend to call such radical changes a solution looking for a problem to solve.

Its one example of where RPM is useful. What makes Warpin not use full is that RPM has a system to check on dependency of packages *and* download the required packages. With Warpin the customer needs to go to *a* website and download the package. Also an updated RPM package is around can ANPM (RPM) can download this.  Warpin can not do this... I like Warpin but it simply lacks a couple of features a lot of end users need.

With the limited human resources I think WPI files are not the solution for the OS/2 community to keep moving forward. When Warpin was developed it was great and a lot of software was distributed with the IBM installer.
The IBM installer is not used a lot anymore. I see to many people at Warpstocks and the Dutch OS/2 user group that can not find software or know how to install it or keep easily keep track of updates. That is why I see people installing dual boot updates with Linux distro's that do provide this functionality.

For me the discussion about the directory structure that RPM puts in place. In fact maybe people like Paul Smedley could get MORE feedback if software could be installed and updated... The people in this forum might know how to keep track of DLL's and everything but enough OS/2 users do not...

Or did I misunderstand your posting ?

Roderick

3
Article Discussions / Re: OS2VOICE RPM Server
« on: February 19, 2018, 11:35:27 pm »
Hi

I talked with Roderick about his idea of having a RPM repository for OS2VOICE that will include OS/2 software (freeware/shareware new and old).  Roderick just gave a condition that he will not host any software that violate any regulation such as copyright laws (The server is located in the Netherlands and Dutch laws applies).

I found it interesting to have a different way to present software to the community in a way that can be downloaded and installed as simple as possible. I also think that the Netlabs RPM repository should not be used for all kind of OS/2 software, so I think it is a good idea to have a different server for it.  But I also think we need more resources on how the community can help creating RPM packaged for their favorite OS/2 software. For the moment I have personally failed creating my first package, but it is something that I need to try harder. But more samples, tutorials and specific information on how to create RPM packaged will be welcome.

So please let me know if you would like to sign in for the OS2VOICE RPM idea (and help with some RPM packaged) and if there are any doubts or things that need to be defined.

If you dislike RPM and don't want to help at all, there is no need to reply.

Regards

Thanks for supporting this effort Martin. I hope my other question kind of answers the legal questions.
I certainly think we can distribute a media player for example in RPM format.

Here is an example of what I bumped in recently. People like Paul Smedley port a lot of software but we rather have him port code then make installation programs and or instructions.

Gerrit Schoenmaker from the Dutch OS/2 user group. He contacted me and asked how to get TAME working with his USB scanner. As it turns out the USBCALLS.DLL was outdated and installing the ArcaOS broke the SANE support.
Paul had build a version of SANE that should fix that. I think the URL was once mentioned on os2world.com.
How would it if the TAME database and SANE updates could be in RPM as well. Update click install...
Now for Gerrit its a job to figure what to get where etc...

One thing suggested at Sigurd Fastenrath his usergroup meeting in Cologne Germany was to introduce a small box to ask for donations. For for example Paul Smedley (if you download something from him).

Plenty of ways to get more movement in the community with this project... This would be a killer app if just like with LInux it would be EASIER to upgrade and install software...

Roderick

4
Article Discussions / Re: OS2VOICE RPM Server
« on: February 19, 2018, 11:24:56 pm »
I don't like the idea of another RPM server. netlabs.org just works and why should it be made more complicate to find a package? Do we expect masses of new packages beside those being already made available on netlabs.org?

If people (or VOICE) like(s) to host those stuff additionally, why not. But the main rep. should remain on netlabs.org, like Hobbes is the server for all others.

I have no in tension to replace the RPM repo at Netlabs.  However I know server Netlabs is short on space and the RPM server on which the repo would be running has 3.5 TB of storage left...

Roderick

5
Article Discussions / Re: OS2VOICE RPM Server
« on: February 19, 2018, 11:18:33 pm »
Hi,
As we seem to be committed to using RPM now, the idea of a OS2VOICE rpm server seems good. There are programs such as FFmpeg that have many dependencies and could really benefit from a package manager as well as many programs where installation could be simplified by using RPM. OTOH, long range plans for ANPM include better support of WPI packages allowing them to co-exist better with rpm, so no need to totally drop Warpin.
Problems come from what exactly are the Dutch (and EU I guess) regulations. Copyright is complex enough with different jurisdictions having not quite compatible copyright laws. eg, a bunch of stuff just entered the public domain here in Canada, but in many jurisdictions, including the States, they're still under copyright. There's also differences in what can be copyrighted, some places a recipe can be copyrighted and others, not. Same with headers, their copyright status is not clear and is likely to vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction and without a court case can be really unclear.
Then there are corner cases such as the discussion on cdrecord where strictly speaking, it seems copyright is being broken by distributing Froloff's patched cdrecord without source so no GPL licence. There's lots of stuff on Hobbes that likewise is probably a copyright violation but as long as the authours don't complain, it is fairly harmless.
More important when talking about multimedia applications in particular are patents. A lot of this stuff is patented and American law, as an example, is pretty strict in enforcement, as well as pretty liberal in what can be patented. I have no idea what the Dutch (and EU) regulations are on these patents and I'm not even sure about my country.
Debian, for example, gets around these problems by having non-free repositories hosted in safe countries, same with projects such as MPlayer. Then there is lame, which simply only distributes source code as it seems it takes a binary to infringe. This also opens up the possibility to compile some software on the users machines to work around these problems.

Last, but not least, is with an expanding number of repositories, is keeping them in sync to avoid RPM hell.

When it comes to copyright infringement I can not distribute for example distribute the OS/4 kernel, sorry guys.
But I can for example also not distribute IBM works repackaged, to just name an example.  While IBM no longer distributes this...

However we can distribute open source software or trial versions of software. For example we could consider repacking Bluecad as an RPM. Its as freeware on hobbes...

When it comes to softwarepatents:  While recently the climate has become  better I think. the United States sucks when it comes to software patents and patent trolls. That said, I see that recent rulings from the US Supreme court have made life of patent trolls a lot harder.  But there is still a long way to go...

The European Union seems to be a cross roads when it comes to software patents. But it seems we are not going down the insane road the US went threw with software patents. But these are uncertain times. That said I find the legal system in the Netherlands a lot better to prevent so called patent trolls from sending out these "license or see you in court letters".

Lastly the VOICE foundation is poor, we have about 10.000 Dollars in the bank currently. So why would anybody sue us. The board members are not liable personally but we should do anything extremely stupid.

So I hope that kind of clears up the atmosphere. The RPM will however also not be a click and upload...
I still need 1 or 2 people that can help with testing RPM package made. I want to be certain they work :-)
I have not yet written a complete policy document as time after time I did not even get 1 RPM to upload myself ready or from somebody else.

What I do think is important is that we bundle everything in one repo next to the Netlabs repo.

I hope that answers some of the questions.

Roderick Klein
President OS/2 VOICE...

6
Events / Re: Reminder about OS/2 VOICE IIRC speaktup in about 18 hours
« on: February 19, 2018, 10:37:04 pm »
Hi,
About memory. While, from my limited understanding, the i386 architecture is limited to 4 GiB address structure (minus overhead for kernel, pci devices and such bringing it closer to 3GiB), it allows something like a terrabyte of virtual memory (48bits). So in theory can for example run 3+ 2GB programs with the only downside being lots of swap file thrashing.
In practice, our kernel (and device drivers), originally designed at a time when 16 MiB of memory was a lot, use lots of 32 bit, often signed, variables and even 16 bit, which gives practical limits in what OS/2 is capable of. For example I discovered the hard way that the system dies with a "swap file full" error when the swap file grows over 2GiB.
Basically we're really limited in the memory department due to design and without rewriting the kernel (and selected device drivers), that's the way it is.
This is what will kill our OS in respect to running modern applications in the new 64bit world. Already developers are not caring about 32bit.

In respect to security, most malware is now browser based, eg using JavaScript. Unluckily we always seem to be a year behind so our browser probably has unpatched vulnerabilities and this probably won't change if we switch to webkit excepting we'll have Chrome flaws instead of Mozilla flaws.
On the bright side, some of this malware expects a Windows (or Android etc) system and will fail on OS/2.

One idea I have heard at Netlabs is the idea that the GCC/LIBC libraries might be able to use the memory that the ArcaOS loader provides on machines with more then 4GB of RAM.  I understood it would not be easy.
But most likely easier then patching the kernel to support PAE. I have always understood this is pretty difficult.

Roderick Klein
President OS/2 VOICE foundation

7
Events / Re: Reminder about OS/2 VOICE IIRC speaktup in about 18 hours
« on: February 18, 2018, 09:41:55 pm »
David when it comes to the killer app I think that is fantasy by now. I will explain why.
More and more its about data and not the OS (platform you run).  While I do not like cloud storage.
I do need a computer to file my tax return and to have convenient access to my bank account etc.
I am more then happy to hear what Eugene his idea is what items we could think of being a killer app for the platform.

I read somewhere that USB 3.0 is getting pretty close. At least at AN they are working on this issue.
Printing we have CUPS and improvements continue to be made on it. ArcaOS I understood ships with a postscript that fixes longstanding issue's for supporting CUPS. \

Wifi is much more complex but its being worked as well by Arca Noae.  The wifi story is long and sadly more complex. I used to work at Mensys and the time the Multimac project was started. The idea was to first work on ethernet drivers by porting LInux code. Work on Wifi got started but after the Linux kernel guys modified something the Multimac Linux approach was broken. I understood from David Azarewicz from Arca Noae that Wifi drivers ARE WAY MORE complex then wifi drivers.  They now have a whole bunch of new ethernet drivers ported with a FreeBSD library and Wifi is being worked on.  So they are working on wifi drivers its just a lot of work. And other projects such as ACPI and other drivers also require attention.

We have the current version of Open Office and work on Firefox and Thunderbird moves on.

Anyway the community can not count on BWW and Arca Noae alone to pull this long overloaded freight train up the mountain. This why I was trying to see if people would be willing to help package RPM packages so that some of this software could be easly found in one repo and installed with one click and updated when updates are released.

All free of charge of course.

8
Events / Re: Reminder about OS/2 VOICE IIRC speaktup in about 18 hours
« on: February 18, 2018, 08:29:59 pm »
Anyway to keep it all very simple. There is not going to be a killer for OS/2 and I do not understand why you put so much focus on this killer application. Such a killer application may have been something possible 20 or 25 years ago. But does days are gone. Even if you would create this killer application you are referring to it would not result in more licenses.  A killer feature would be reimplemented on other platforms (mobile phone and tablet in no time).

What is a strong point as Martin mentioned running your OS/2 applications today on current hardware and that OS/2 is not a cloud connected OS that (like an Android phone) leaks data. You have not complete, but you have MORE privacy/control then with other devices/OS'es. That would be not a killer feature, but a killer functionality...

That said in order for people to use an operating they need more then just ONE killer app. Hence the idea for more software in RPM software to make the useability of the platform slightly bigger. LIke a repackaged media player that installs with a one click...

9
Events / Re: Reminder about OS/2 VOICE IIRC speaktup in about 18 hours
« on: February 18, 2018, 04:53:27 pm »
The question was asked by Eugene. But I think its realistic to say that Arca Noae is already pretty much overloaded.
As in bringing out this killer app, I do not know why people think we as a community can come up with a killer app for OS/2. The whole idea is nice, but I simply do not think its realistic.

I think what we as a community could help with to keep current users on OS/2 and try and attrack more people to OS/2 (at least try...) is by starting with this RPM library I suggested. See articles.os2voice.org for details.
Making it easier to install software such as media players, ported games, sorted by category.

How often do I not get or to see the question what software is around for OS/2. But that is just a thought. How can we focus on things we can do today and might me easier todo that to look for one killer app...

Roderick

10
Events / Reminder about OS/2 VOICE IIRC speaktup in about 18 hours
« on: February 16, 2018, 10:00:11 pm »
Reposting from last week:

Dear OS/2 users,

OS/2 VOICE used to organize IRC speaks with developers and organizations supporting the OS/2 community.

The good news is we will be holding a series of speaks ups via IRC.
If you are unfamiliar with how IRC works, then no problem.
While you can use an IRC client you can also use a your browser, which in my opinion is easier:
Before the meeting starts you goto the following URL:
https://webchat.freenode.net/

Fill in your nickname: Its preferred if you use your real name.
At the channel name fill #os2voice.

The first IRC speakup will be targeted at Westen Europe, Afrika and the American continent.
You will be able to ask questions to the Arca Noae LCC.

The speakup with Arca Noae LLC will be held on the Saturday the 17th of February and start ats 17:00 hours Amsterdam/Berlin Time. Which means:
19:00 Moscow time
11:00am New York time
08:00am Los Angeles time

The second speakup is will be held on the Sunday the 25th of February.
I will start at 02:00 Moscow time, 0:00 Amsterdam time, local time Syndey 09:00 in the moring. This means for people in New York the second speakup will start on 24th of February 18:00 hours New York time!

This second speakup is to try and accommodate the OS/2 users in Asia, Australia and New Zealand.

Its the in tension that as many of the developers from Arca NOae will be present to answer your questions. The speakup is intended to not last longer then 1 1/2 to 2 hours.

Best regards,

Roderick Klein
President OS/2 VOICE

11
Comments, Suggestions & Questions / SSL OS/2world
« on: January 23, 2018, 11:40:54 pm »
While the postings on os2world.com are not really that secret. Is OS2WORLD.COM going to use SSL encryption ?
As in the near future web browsers such as Firefox will warn if a website does not use SSL. It might scare away users... Just a thought...

Roderick

12
Setup & Installation / Re: Update ISO Image with new Drivers
« on: January 23, 2018, 11:36:16 pm »
I presume you are using ArcaOS. Do you have ArcaOS 5.0 or 5.01 ? Your system might work if you download ArcaOS 5.01. Updating the boot images on the DVD is pretty complex. Hence my advise.

Best regards,

Roderick Klein

13
Programming / Re: OS/2 kernel requiring speculative execution patch!!!!
« on: January 03, 2018, 06:21:52 am »
So I'm sure many are aware of the news regarding the flaw in Intel's speculative execution in the majority of the CPUs:
https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/01/02/intel_cpu_design_flaw/

The problem doesn't end there, it affects anything i686 and newer (as this was when speculative execution was introduced):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P6_(microarchitecture)

Which means, anything Pentium II and newer is affected.

Will ArcaNoae be working on patching the OS/2 kernel with KPTI? Otherwise I won't be able to consider OS/2 a viable OS for going on the internet anymore for anything personal.

If you want to know if  Arca Noae wants to patch the kernel then you should also open a ticket on
https://mantis.arcanoae.com. They have stated repeatedly no ticket=no support.

Roderick

14
Programming / Re: Compiling an OS/2 Driver
« on: December 31, 2017, 06:27:32 pm »
Also forgot about the Microsoft C compiler. Its better to use the Open Watcom compiler. It may not be suitable to compile Mozilla with as that requires GCC. The Open Watcom compiler seems to be much stricter in grabbing any errors in your code then Visual Age or the Microsoft 6 C compiler that is included in the DDK. Also the Open Watcom code I understands generates better optimized code.

If you do want to write an article recommending how to write drivers.

* Include some decent comment in the code.

* Any kind of source control system is your friend. Having worked at Mensys the fact  drivers where *frequently* checked in made it *easier* to find why a certain version of a driver would suddenly blow up. Its then easier to locate the code that was modified.

As I have said so often, finding the cause of a kernel dump can be extremely time consuming.  That is why the above conditions may cost some time when you work on you project. But you will be gladd you did it when you run into a problem.

Roderick

15
Multimedia / Re: How to change the audio card driver
« on: December 31, 2017, 03:41:35 pm »
CHeck the documentation in readme.txt in the directory
\CID\SERVER\MMOS2\DRIVERS\UNIAUD and see if /A: switch is usefull so you can select the audio chip which the driver uses to control

Roderick

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