Author Topic: OpenDOC - Source Code  (Read 865 times)

Martin Iturbide

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OpenDOC - Source Code
« on: April 27, 2024, 06:36:44 pm »
Hello.

There source code of OpenDOC released to the public with the intentions to be preserved.
- https://github.com/atcurtis/OpenDoc

I have zero experience with OpenDOC, as far as I know it was a framework created by Apple and with IBM and Microsoft they tried to turn it into a standard. I think it was close source and was discontinued on 1997.

I can not even list (or remember) one software that was created with OpenDOC on any of the platforms (OS/2, MacOS 7, Windows, or AIX). I guess all software created with OpenDOC was close source, so we can not even think on bringing some of that old software and port it to OS/2 today.

But on the bright side, I think it is interesting to keep releasing the source code of old software to the public for learning purposes or even some inspiration for something new.

If someone wants to chitchat and give some some insights, personal comments, opinions, it appreciated.

Regards
Martin Iturbide
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Roderick Klein

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Re: OpenDOC - Source Code
« Reply #1 on: April 27, 2024, 09:08:17 pm »
Hello.

There source code of OpenDOC released to the public with the intentions to be preserved.
- https://github.com/atcurtis/OpenDoc

I have zero experience with OpenDOC, as far as I know it was a framework created by Apple and with IBM and Microsoft they tried to turn it into a standard. I think it was close source and was discontinued on 1997.

I can not even list (or remember) one software that was created with OpenDOC on any of the platforms (OS/2, MacOS 7, Windows, or AIX). I guess all software created with OpenDOC was close source, so we can not even think on bringing some of that old software and port it to OS/2 today.

But on the bright side, I think it is interesting to keep releasing the source code of old software to the public for learning purposes or even some inspiration for something new.

If someone wants to chitchat and give some some insights, personal comments, opinions, it appreciated.

Regards

I think the OS/2 port was scrapped pretty quickly. And the standard had pretty serious security issue's. I seem to recall this was part of the reason Apple dropped it.
But this is from what I recall from many years ago.

Roderick

Martin Iturbide

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Re: OpenDOC - Source Code
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2024, 04:58:31 pm »
Thanks Roderick for the feedback.

I just remembered some Steve Jobs video, after his return to Apple, saying something about his decision for killing OpenDOC. Something like it does not fit on his strategy, like it was not relevant. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeqPrUmVz-o

Trying to find which OS/2 apps we have with OpenDOC I just found that "TrueSpectra OpenDoc component", Some Lotus Components (not specified in detail), WebPainter and Mesa 2 (Spreadsheet).

This is the best source I found about OpenDOC on OS/2: http://www.edm2.com/index.php/OpenDoc

It seems that it never got relevant to OS/2.

Regards
Martin Iturbide
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Roderick Klein

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Re: OpenDOC - Source Code
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2024, 05:13:09 pm »
I think it was in Warp 4 original install media. But I seem to recall after that no further updates where released or new versions for OS/2.
Again off the top of my memory.

Roderick

SoundChaser

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Re: OpenDOC - Source Code
« Reply #4 on: April 29, 2024, 11:04:13 pm »
I think it was in Warp 4 original install media.

Indeed. I think it was in the selective install options?

The code in there remains really interesting for concerns outside of the OpenDoc context, however:

- we get to see excellent examples of clean Workplace Shell integration C++ code:
  https://github.com/atcurtis/OpenDoc/blob/main/os2/src/docshell/OS2Shell.cpp
- ... and its IDL counterpart
  https://github.com/atcurtis/OpenDoc/blob/main/os2/src/docshell/idl/OS2Shell.idl


There's an effing full bento format implementation:
   https://github.com/atcurtis/OpenDoc/tree/main/com/src/bento


What's the value? Well, some application formats relied on Bento, just as Microsoft file formats relied on OLE/COM Structured Storage format. Can be useful to inspect the structure of old archived media files from early Avid workstations, for example (http://justsolve.archiveteam.org/wiki/OMF_Interchange) although the data won't be immediately readable without reverse engineering yet for forensics and archeology, I can definitely see value there for many multimedia applications (Avid Symphony/Media Composer, ProTools...)




SoundChaser

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Re: OpenDOC - Source Code
« Reply #5 on: April 29, 2024, 11:16:03 pm »
Also... should someone manage to build the runtime, these could be use to test the end result :-)

https://github.com/OS2World/DEV-SAMPLES-IBM_OpenDoc

Martin Iturbide

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Re: OpenDOC - Source Code
« Reply #6 on: April 29, 2024, 11:52:59 pm »
Thanks for the feedback SoundChaser.
Martin Iturbide
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Sean Casey

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Re: OpenDOC - Source Code
« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2024, 12:26:15 am »
I recall speaking with Carla Hanzlik, Sundial Systems, regarding Taligent and OpenDoc's People, Places, and Things metaphor.  Sundial Systems had a lot of time invested in Taligent and it was believed Relish version 3 would incorporate its technology.   

A variety of interconnected remote users, collaborative work spaces, data and objects disbursed throughout a network. Developers would write helper components that operate on different types of data instead of writing full applications.  OpenDoc would be the common component interchange glue.  This would eliminate monolithic applications and software suites.  Essentially, someone can assemble their own software suite using individual components that are part of the operating environment.

I believe the OpenDoc framework was developed by an alliance with Apple, IBM, and Motorola to counter Microsoft's growing dominance.  HP also had some ownership and contributed IP.  While Apple was developing their own OS utilizing OpenDoc, IBM had planned to use the framework within its Workplace OS and planned a Taligent personality module.

SoundChaser

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Re: OpenDOC - Source Code
« Reply #8 on: April 30, 2024, 04:20:15 am »
A fair chunk of the Taligent C++ coding style ended up in the Open Class framework in VAC++4 which unfortunately is too much an esoteric environment to work with. I wonder if anyone tried to compile these modules with another compiler than IBM xlc (say MSFT cl.exe) which would have given a second life to that otherwise very interesting tech.

The book Taligent's guide to designing programs : well-mannered object-oriented design in C++ remains an excellent book.

Lars

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Re: OpenDOC - Source Code
« Reply #9 on: April 30, 2024, 07:44:12 pm »
1) the Warp4 Toolkit (NOT the Warp 4.5 toolkit) came with a whole OpenDoc subdirectory, including all documentation (in HTML format)
2) there existed OpenDoc Version 1.2, multiple self-extracting installation executables. It is likely the same stuff as is contained in:
http://www.hobbesarchive.com/Home/Download?path=/Hobbes/pub/os2/dev/tools/toolkits/OpenDoc_1-2.zip
and it can also be found here:
https://www.adofai.gg/HOBBES/dev/opendoc/

I have both on CD-ROM.
« Last Edit: April 30, 2024, 08:19:38 pm by Lars »