Hi,
for those interested:
I updated an Merlin CP2 with UPDCD, with some fixpacs (Fixpac 5, TCPIP 2334, MPTS 8703, Kernel 104a_W4), updated drivers and so on to get an updated, bootable, installable OS/2 Merlin DVD.
- NO FILES FROM ECOMSTATION USED (I just installed the Intel LAN Driver to see if it works, it does ;-) )
And guess what:
I started an installation on my Lenovo X200T (Core2Duo SL9600) in the docking station with an internal DVD burner:
It went thróugh without any issues! No problems with test.cfg and so on!!! (it was no "cloning" or something like this necessary, it was just "install")
I do have:
- Sound
- SNAP Grafis (no Panorama needed, SNAP shows 1280X800 true colour = native)
- USB
- LAN (with the Mensys Driver)
- JFS support
- Xworkplace with "tuning config.sys via Config.sys Editor)
- WLAN (I changed half a year ago to a Intel4965)
to say it short: everything seems to work fine! Even in AHCI mode - so far! (Installation was made in Compatibility mode)
I will give it more tests (HPFS 386, SMP from Warp Server, Stylus, and UMTS) during the week and finally will make a video about it next weekend, if hopefully everything will run ;-)
Disadvantage:
- There may be Interupt clashes because of NO ACPI (does not matter because eCS 2 ACPI did not work reliable on this Laptop as well)
- No Powermanagement (does not matter because eCS2 Powermanagement did not work reliable as well)
And important to me:
- I did not need Airboot Manager to install (DFSEE and IBM Bootmanager fit perfect the needs even alongside Windows 7 - as I mentioned several times before)
- No need to change any files (test.cfg or so on)
- installed "out of the box"
- SNAP does work, no need for Panorama
- UPDCD let me include the whole Bonuspac with Warp Guides as well (so I do have the full "Warp 4 feeling")
- Suprisingly after switching in BIOS back to ACPI there seem to be no difference (but I am sure I will find at least some ;-) )
- it is running on a Corsair 2 SSD 120GB - it is that fast!!!!!!
- JFS support is inlcuded in MCP 2
Here is a link to a picture:
http://www.commtalk.org/FileRepository/ForumAttachments/99-78846-IMAG0400a.jpg
So, that's all - one can use even OS/2 Warp 4 MCP 2 on modern hardware......
:-)
Best to all of you!
Sigurd, you have just proved what I have been thinking for some time - straight OS/2 installs on more systems than some people would believe.
ivan
Hi Ivan,
yes - it proofed to me as well something I was thinking about for at least the last six years, and finally there it was. And it was not that difficult (as allways said from others).
And that raised new (in fact old) questions about what happend during the last six years to OS/2 - but for me I can leave it as it is.
I have got OS/2 Warp 4 running on modern hardware, I have to see if it will run reliable and usable in the next days, but I do have some hope from what I discovered till now - no crashes at all.
Ciao!
I don't understand what is the goal?
Is it historical review of IBM OS/2 Warp? Then this experiments are valuable for the community.
What is the reason to mention (kick) eComStation every time? Why do you separate the system to: IBM OS/2 Warp part and eComStation part? eComStation is a modification OS/2 Warp of 2011.
It's like compare John from kindergarden (1996) and school (2011). Both versions of John are good. John 2011 fully depends on John 1996. John 1996 doesn't exist anymore, he morphed to John 1997.
Again,
1) Sound - do you use IBM drivers? Or Uniaud developed for eComStation?
2) SNAP? old SNAP or SNAP developed for eCS?
3) Exigen USB or USB 2011?
4) LAN, Wifi - we all know the history of network drivers
5) Old JFS or eCS JFS?
6) xWorkPlace - was developed for eComStation users from eComStation budget
etc.
Main question - are you going distribute the image? Or distribute the scripts to generate it?
And the second question - do you have documentation for your updates? SVN server?
Hi Sigurd
I very much doubt that your OS/2 system is using AHCI disk access. Why? - there is no OS/2 driver capable of doing that currently. You will probably find that danis506 has switched disk access to Compatibility despite BIOS setting.
You may be able to get the multiple cpus working using SMP kernel package and os2apic.psd
Regards
Pete
Hi Eugene
Nice post defending eComstation but it has some mistakes:-
SNAP was never developed for eComStation. eComStation purchased a license to include a "cut down" version of the current SNAP build. The main difference is that with the full SNAP package you can simply power off the system change graphics card to a different card that has SNAP support and then boot without fannying around with the graphics driver. I would agree that it is possible that SNAP development would have stopped sooner than it did if eCS had not licensed it for inclusion in eCS.
xWorkPlace was not developed for eCS. eCS supplies eWorkPlace - a "cut down" version of xWorkPlace. I prefer to *not* install eWorkPlace during an eCS install and add in xWorkPlace after the eCS install has finished - and I doubt that I am the only person who does that.
Regards
Pete
Quote from: Pete on 2011.03.28, 18:28:59
SNAP was never developed for eComStation. eComStation purchased a license to include a "cut down" version of the current SNAP build. The main difference is that with the full SNAP package you can simply power off the system change graphics card to a different card that has SNAP support and then boot without fannying around with the graphics driver. I would agree that it is possible that SNAP development would have stopped sooner than it did if eCS had not licensed it for inclusion in eCS.
Several versions of SNAP were released for eCS users during 2005 and 2006, we got contacts with Scitech to develop ACPI driver.
http://ecomstation.ru/commentnews.php?id=1230
Quote from: Pete on 2011.03.28, 18:28:59
xWorkPlace was not developed for eCS. eCS supplies eWorkPlace - a "cut down" version of xWorkPlace. I prefer to *not* install eWorkPlace during an eCS install and add in xWorkPlace after the eCS install has finished - and I doubt that I am the only person who does that.
No, XWorkPlace was developed by the order of Serenity Systems. Is it based on XFolder class. The debugging of the extender continued during several years.
As always, I don't understand Eugene Gorbunoff position.
Why is he defending eComStation if nobody is attacking it?
- Uniaud is open source. It can be used respecting the open source license.
- SNAP turned to freeware some years ago.
- xWorkplace is open source under GNU GPL license.
- USB 2011 drivers are free for download at hobbes.
- Intel LAN driver is also open source.
Eugene, It doesn't matter who paid for that ports, when it is open source you can use it respecting the open source license. No matter which OS it is, you can even port it to Windows and use it legally.
Eugene, is your reply part of your "eCS pirating paranoia" or just want to give credit to eComStation ?
Hi Eugene,
yes - it might be painfull for you - but I was really able to kick ecomstation from my modern Hardware and replace it with OS/2 Warp 4!!!
That is really hard, isn't it?
Usually I would not answer to those questions, but you asked me to do so, here it comes (Yes and I know, there are others around that might be harmed by this as well, but this is not my intention - if you believe it or not - I was and am looking for a way to use OS/2 on modern hardware - did this with eCs2 for years now, as one can read and see at youtube....And I am as suprised as most of you!)
- Bye the way - just writing this with Firefox 4 and Warp 4 via WLAN from the Thinkpad!
- NO, there are no files of eComStation
- NO, there are no files from eCo Software too - and as I told you several times - there will be never ever one! you know why.
- NO, xworkplace was developed by Ulrich Möller - without him there would be nothing at all
- NO, WLAN drivers are developed by Willibald Meyer - no one else (GENMAC)
- NO, I allways recommend (read my instructions) to use SNAP 3.18 FULL version NOT the eCS one!
- NO, I do not need Panorama - SNAP is better by far - why should I sue it?
- NO, I do use the "original" USB drivers, one was updated (EHCI) by Rudi for Emperoar TV, wich I have a license for as well
- NO, I use the IBM JFS - no need for bootable JFS (it may be worth to read the text from Sjoerd Visser about JFS, especially how big the partition has to be berfore it makes sence to use JFS at all ( cache")
- NO, I do not need any kind of different bootmanager than the IBM Bootmanager (No Airboot and so on and so on)
- NO, with OS/2 Merlin my System is not getting hot, it is much more reliable, no crashes until now!! - thats really hard to believe, but it is the truth!, sad as it may be...
- NO, the installation went fluent without any errors!!!!
- NO, I do not use OS/4 kernel nor eCS kernel :-)
And most painfull:
I guess because of my experience with eCS2 and modern hardware I can tell you that all this is even for me hard to believe - I did this in my spare time, I guess a skilled one can do all this (update MCP2 with UPDCD) in about ONE day, so what did happen during the last six years???? These are the questions I did answer in other threads, and from now on I can even PROOF it!
But as I wrote before - i am not interested in these discussions any more - I already discovered for myself that Merlin is the better choice - and again - the eCS2 German is - after six years - still the "never come true project", allways rescheduled from time to time due to minor problems e.g. "Boot manager". And as I wrote before as well: this is the fact that makes me really said - what a waste of time and resources......
And I know there are people around who just want to say: what do you want? Leave it if you do not like it. Yes, I left ecs2 - I found a better one in the past!!
Strange, isn't it?
To Pete: I myself can not believe it: OS/2 Warp 4 Merlin DOES run with AHCI - I will show it in the video. but, as I said, installation has to be done in Compatibility mode.
And I am in contact with Zsolt Kaddar to fix one more issue I would like to have: integrate installation from USB - HOOOOO - one of the BIG STEPS FORWARD from Mensys - in fact it was Daniela Engert who just suggested to change two lines in config.sys........(remeber "Netbook times")
I do not want to persuade anyone to do anything, I just write what I for myself discovered and did. And it is great to have OS/2 Warp 4, the familiar and "beloved" interface on modern hardware :-)
> Martín Itúrbide wrote:
> - Uniaud is open source. It can be used respecting the open source license.
> - SNAP turned to freeware some years ago.
> - xWorkplace is open source under GNU GPL license.
> - USB 2011 drivers are free for download at hobbes.
> - Intel LAN driver is also open source.
yes, yes, yes, yes, yes
> Eugene, It doesn't matter who paid for that ports, when it is open source you can use it
> respecting the open source license. No matter which OS it is, you can even port it to Windows
> and use it legally.
yes
> Eugene, is your reply part of your "eCS pirating paranoia" or just want to give credit to eComStation ?
yes, I just want to give credit to eComStation.
"eCS pirating paranoia" - I don't understand what you mean. OS/2 World Forum moderators are protecting the developers of eCS shareware applications. I don't have claims.
Hi Sigurd
If there is no OS/2 AHCI driver how do you think this is working?
As I understand it later builds of danis506.add can switch off AHCI and use Compatibility mode on some hardware - and this is what I suspect is happening here.
Regards
Pete
Eugene,
what is your intention here?
This is "OS/2 World" - not "eComStation world".
You have to accept that many people stick with OS/2 - which is to some point also because eComStation progress has suffered some huge "pitfalls" which are mainly related to your way of doing project suboptimal management while on the other side producing nothing more than a lot of "hot air". In other words: Talk is cheap. Results count. You failed more than once on both ways.
I will say it politely (but I know you will NEVER understand):
Sometimes less is more.
Sometimes not saying anything says more than a thousand words.
And saves me from typing such a bullshit once again. Heck, you again managed to make me go crazy...
There are 3 ways for you to react to Sigurds post:
- nothing (that would have been nice!)
- say "Congrats - can you share your experience? (-> very constructive, positive, collaborative way)
- write a whole sermon of dipshit (worst case. but astonishingly that's what you did...)
Why can't you just leave people in peace, return to your desk,...
...and get your damn job done?
But I offer a resolution:
Should we compare the number of visitors of your (2, 3, 4 ?) sessions at Warpstock Europe versus the number of visitors of Sigurds (1) presentation? Think about that before you mess around here.
And did you want to show-off with that crap on "SVN"?
Why the heck should Sigurd put the stuff on a SVN? It is all documented in his post - standard stuff. No need for SVN.
I remember the last time I "updated" ACPI. There were lots of OUTDATED BACKLEVEL parts in it. And YOU dare talking about SVN?
Heck, you can't even pack the right files in a ZIP!!
Why didn't you ask Sigurd for his Hudson CI setup while we're at it? JFC.
Finally, looking at the time it took you to "flame" around here... it could have been invested much better:
I am still waiting for your session descriptions for WSE2011. See my email.
Cheers,
Thomas
Quote from: EugeneGorbunoff on 2011.03.28, 19:10:34
Quote from: Pete on 2011.03.28, 18:28:59
xWorkPlace was not developed for eCS. eCS supplies eWorkPlace - a "cut down" version of xWorkPlace. I prefer to *not* install eWorkPlace during an eCS install and add in xWorkPlace after the eCS install has finished - and I doubt that I am the only person who does that.
No, XWorkPlace was developed by the order of Serenity Systems. Is it based on XFolder class. The debugging of the extender continued during several years.
IIRC, Ulrich was working on xWorkPlace before SS approached him. It was smarter and easier for him to make a new package with xFolder as a subset instead of making the additional xWorkplace features a subset of xFolder. eWorkplace is a
subset of xWorlplace.
Similar timeline also applies to eStyler/Styler2.
Sadly, even though they are ideal for the general/new OS/2 user, both (eWorkplace/eStyler) are limited in comparison to their OS/2 releases.
That aside, there are pros and cons to all the arguments presented here. Sigurd and most of the rest of us are not the common OS/2 user. Nor are we some poor Windows tech who is stuck supporting legacy OS/2 setups for large companies. Those people will not be able to go through the steps that Sigurd (or others of us) have went through to get OS/2 ACP/MCP working on newer systems.
On top of that, there are systems where ACP/MCP will NOT work on, or will NOT work on properly. These are systems that MUST have a working ACPI setup to run or run properly. A good example are the two IBM eServer xSeries 440 units we have. WSeB CP2 PF will install fine on them (for someone knowledgeable on OS/2), BUT, hyperthreading will NOT work, neither will more than two CPUs - the machine supports SIXTEEN CPUs. Though the machine supposedly follows the MP1.4 spec, it does NOT. There are too many variances in how it operates for more than 2 CPUs to allow OS2APIC to properly recognize and initialize the CPUs. For these systems, eCS v2 is the ONLY option to get full capabilities out of the machines - otherwise, people are limited to *2* CPUs instead of *16* CPUs. So, yes, WSeB will run on them, and run very darn well -
but at 1/8th the capabilities of the machine. That's with
every non-eCS fixpack and update to the OS, drivers, kernel, etc. There is something in the setup that requires ACPI to properly function.
So, in scenarios like that, it does NOT matter how one updates the WSeB/MCP/ACP disks... without the subsequent updates that eCS v2 has, those systems will NOT be fully utilized. In others, yes, updating MCP/ACP may indeed result in a fully operational system.
But that brings us back to the point at hand. One cannot say that "eCS is not necessary... one simply needs to update ACP/MCP with UpCD" just as one cannot say that "eCS is necessary for all newer hardware because MCP/ACP cannot be gotten to work with them"
NEITHER is true of all scenarios. EITHER only apply to CERTAIN scenarios for CERTAIN hardware. It is really senseless to argue EITHER point as a "be all, end all, one size fits all" scenario, because doing so would not be correct or accurate.
And for those of you who cannot stop to think about the VAST difference in your experience installing using OS/2 or eCS in comparison to the tens of thousands of corporate installs STILL running that get supported by some Windows tech who really knows nothing about computers - much less OS/2, I recently was engaged in a support email situation where one such tech couldn't figure out how to install network drivers for an OS/2 installation (one that was otherwise working fine). Even with DETAILED, SPECIFIC instructions that applied to his EXACT setup, the machine is (by the end of our communications) STILL not networked - TEN days. You guys and I could tie one hand behind our backs, close both of our eyes, take a nap and install the drivers for this particular card at the same time.
...ok, maybe we'd have to have at least one eye open and be awake to do it, but you get the point. For someone like those people, even if they are WONDERFUL Windows Techs (as this guy probably was), eCS is really the only viable option.
Everyone here can argue back and forth based on their experiences... but like any product, or any service, our experiences do not necessarily apply to all hardware, or to the experiences of those who are doing the work. Kinda makes it senseless to come to such conclusions on EITHER side of this figurative fence, doesn't it?
Quote from: Pete on 2011.03.28, 21:30:40
Hi Sigurd
If there is no OS/2 AHCI driver how do you think this is working?
As I understand it later builds of danis506.add can switch off AHCI and use Compatibility mode on some hardware - and this is what I suspect is happening here.
Regards
Pete
Hi Pete,
it may be as you suggest - I guess I am not skilled enough to find the reason, but this seems to me to be logical. It is even more strange: in Compatibility mode I can not use WLAN - if I switch to AHCI I can use it...
There seems to be some interupt clashes (as I wrote in the first mail), I do have to do more testing here, but a lack of time. I guess after next weekend I can say more about it. Fortunatley the BIOS of the X200T let my specifiy PCI Lane IRQ by hand and it may be worth (regarding WLAN) to disable Speedstep in BIOS: Hm. I will see.
WLAN and Sound are sharing the same IRQ, as well with one UHCI controller, I have to see what to do there. In AHCI those work, but there seems to be the Mousepointer "jumping" from time to time - it may be a result of using an SSD - it may be to fast at all in AHCI mode, so that it is to fast to handle the input given by the Trackpoint.
By the way: eCS2 did have these IRQ problems as well, with and without ACPI support, WLAN sometimes usable, sometimes not - USB Modem sometimes usable, sometimes crashes (50/50 chance).
I will try the new USB drivers from Lars Erdmann in this environment as well.
And to this question: I only use "free availiable" drivers, as Martin stated, I share (see Installation reviews for netbooks, for eCS2 alongside Windows 7 , the youtube movies and so on) all my knowledge and investigations all FOR FREE (and so it will be in the future as well). For eCS 2 German - promised since years, never came true - just read that at Warpstock there will be a presentation about eCS 3 (!!!).0 - I did pay several times SSS......
Therefore I wrote I will leave it as it is.
Thanks Robert for your sensible and knowledgeable comments.
Quote from: RobertM on 2011.03.28, 22:06:03
Quote from: EugeneGorbunoff on 2011.03.28, 19:10:34
Quote from: Pete on 2011.03.28, 18:28:59
xWorkPlace was not developed for eCS. eCS supplies eWorkPlace - a "cut down" version of xWorkPlace. I prefer to *not* install eWorkPlace during an eCS install and add in xWorkPlace after the eCS install has finished - and I doubt that I am the only person who does that.
No, XWorkPlace was developed by the order of Serenity Systems. Is it based on XFolder class. The debugging of the extender continued during several years.
IIRC, Ulrich was working on xWorkPlace before SS approached him. It was smarter and easier for him to make a new package with xFolder as a subset instead of making the additional xWorkplace features a subset of xFolder. eWorkplace is a subset of xWorlplace.
Similar timeline also applies to eStyler/Styler2.
Sadly, even though they are ideal for the general/new OS/2 user, both (eWorkplace/eStyler) are limited in comparison to their OS/2 releases.
That aside, there are pros and cons to all the arguments presented here. Sigurd and most of the rest of us are not the common OS/2 user. Nor are we some poor Windows tech who is stuck supporting legacy OS/2 setups for large companies. Those people will not be able to go through the steps that Sigurd (or others of us) have went through to get OS/2 ACP/MCP working on newer systems.
On top of that, there are systems where ACP/MCP will NOT work on, or will NOT work on properly. These are systems that MUST have a working ACPI setup to run or run properly. A good example are the two IBM eServer xSeries 440 units we have. WSeB CP2 PF will install fine on them (for someone knowledgeable on OS/2), BUT, hyperthreading will NOT work, neither will more than two CPUs - the machine supports SIXTEEN CPUs. Though the machine supposedly follows the MP1.4 spec, it does NOT. There are too many variances in how it operates for more than 2 CPUs to allow OS2APIC to properly recognize and initialize the CPUs. For these systems, eCS v2 is the ONLY option to get full capabilities out of the machines - otherwise, people are limited to *2* CPUs instead of *16* CPUs. So, yes, WSeB will run on them, and run very darn well - but at 1/8th the capabilities of the machine. That's with every non-eCS fixpack and update to the OS, drivers, kernel, etc. There is something in the setup that requires ACPI to properly function.
So, in scenarios like that, it does NOT matter how one updates the WSeB/MCP/ACP disks... without the subsequent updates that eCS v2 has, those systems will NOT be fully utilized. In others, yes, updating MCP/ACP may indeed result in a fully operational system.
But that brings us back to the point at hand. One cannot say that "eCS is not necessary... one simply needs to update ACP/MCP with UpCD" just as one cannot say that "eCS is necessary for all newer hardware because MCP/ACP cannot be gotten to work with them"
NEITHER is true of all scenarios. EITHER only apply to CERTAIN scenarios for CERTAIN hardware. It is really senseless to argue EITHER point as a "be all, end all, one size fits all" scenario, because doing so would not be correct or accurate.
And for those of you who cannot stop to think about the VAST difference in your experience installing using OS/2 or eCS in comparison to the tens of thousands of corporate installs STILL running that get supported by some Windows tech who really knows nothing about computers - much less OS/2, I recently was engaged in a support email situation where one such tech couldn't figure out how to install network drivers for an OS/2 installation (one that was otherwise working fine). Even with DETAILED, SPECIFIC instructions that applied to his EXACT setup, the machine is (by the end of our communications) STILL not networked - TEN days. You guys and I could tie one hand behind our backs, close both of our eyes, take a nap and install the drivers for this particular card at the same time.
...ok, maybe we'd have to have at least one eye open and be awake to do it, but you get the point. For someone like those people, even if they are WONDERFUL Windows Techs (as this guy probably was), eCS is really the only viable option.
Everyone here can argue back and forth based on their experiences... but like any product, or any service, our experiences do not necessarily apply to all hardware, or to the experiences of those who are doing the work. Kinda makes it senseless to come to such conclusions on EITHER side of this figurative fence, doesn't it?
Hi Robert,
yes, you are for sure right. I think I may not wrote clear enough that I am - as allways - only
speaking for myself on my hardware and my experiences. I never wrote "there is no need for ecomstation" - I did wrote "there is no need for ecomstation anymore
for me".
And that's it. For some I may stress this fact to hard, but from time to time I got phonecalls from Mensys who allways told me: this will never run (BM and Windows 7, next to Windows 7 at all), Warp 4 will never run on modern hardware and so on, I can understand that they want to protect their product - but hey - once I tried I ALLWAYS proofed them wrong. And this does not make me happy nor victorious, it makes me sad, if you believe it or not. And that is something I just want to tell - I know at least some people who want to be informed about differenz ways of "OS/2 on modern hardware", i.e. I created a full usable Warp 4 FP 15 VDI for Virtualbox 4.04 (what I have been told - you may guess it - is impossible).
And please do not forget - there is an english eCS 2since may last year, I never saw the german one I paid for. I think also it is the right of a customer to ask or demand the things he paid for years but never came true (Yes - I am as tired as you reading this of writing this).
In my opinion it would benefit the community if more people would just test or try what they thing that
might be possible, just to give it a try and to let others share their knowledge.
I think if we just could seat together somewhere (may be with a cold beer and some small dishes) and talk from face to face there would have not been half of all this missunderstandings. It is not that easy for me as I am not using my mothertongue to allways hit exactly the point I try to explain. And therfore it may sometimes sound "hard" or "Harming" but this is not my intention, I am just writing about proffable facts that I on my machines do experience.
For
me it is that simple: eCS 2 is dead for me as long as there is no reliable ACPI, I looked for an alternative and Merlin CP2 showed up and (till now - but as I worte - deep testing has to follow) fitts all my needs.
For me it is just Hobby and I am happy if there are some around who are able to benefit at least a bit from the things I did through the years. ;)
Hi Sigurd,
My reply wasn't directed specifically at you (or Eugene for that matter). ALL of us, myself included, are guilty of giving such impressions from time to time, and probably unintentionally.
The problem is, when we do so, or when someone erroneously thinks we are doing so, that's when counterproductive arguments (like the one in this thread and elsewhere) start. That's something we've all agreed isn't necessary or helpful. I was simply trying to bring this conversation back to the true point at hand... on your Lenovo X200T, you managed to get MCP working.
We all need to make an effort in how we choose our wording... none of us should ever be saying things that imply a need for eCS or a lack of need for eCS for everyone else - which is something we've all done, usually unintentionally, from time to time. Instead, we must be careful to make posts that say "On *MY* (whatever machine) MCP worked" or "On *MY* (whatever machine) I needed eCS to get it to work"
The other thing everyone has to remember is that much of our posts do not make sense (or arent helpful) to the numerous people who surf in here for information to support some installation at work. They are by and large people without any OS/2 experience, and will not understand much of the more vague stuff we "pronounce as fact" because of a lack of referential information. For instance (totally made up example):
"ACP will not run properly on newer machines using Intel chipsets"
- what the heck does that mean? Define newer? 2 years old? 5? 10?
- what chipsets? Intel has made dozens or hundreds of variants. Surely this statement doesnt apply to ALL newer Intel chipsets.
While that's a made up example, it holds true for certain machines using Intel chipsets - and not for others. But it gets worse... the time frame for "newer" isn't even static. I can tell you without a shadow of doubt that there are some 4 year old machines that ACP *will* install and run on - and yet there are some 8 year old machines it will NOT.
Because of how vague and non-specific such things are, WE run into this problem in arguing stuff with each other too...
What would be REALLY helpful is, without us misreading or attacking each other or arguing with each other, we post information on each machine/OS combination as we come across it.
Perhaps the Wiki side of OS/2 World is a good place for that? If not, we can do it in these forums... naming threads similar to how you (Sigurd) did with this one... and then all of us need to stay away from the eCS vs OS/2 for installation battles.
What that means is let's drop the little jabs about "And I didnt need eCS at all" or "Only eCS will install on hardware of this age"
Honestly, none of that is necessary. Using this thread as an example (sorry Sigurd, not trying to single you out), Sigurd has gotten MCP to run on his X200T. Other than as a footnote indicating that no eCS files were used in the attempt, there is absolutely NO need to mention eCS AT ALL. And the same should hold true for threads about installing eCS on certain hardware - unless certain files were grabbed from ACP/MCP, there's no reason to mention them in such posts.
THEN: when we are done with such posts, we have valid, helpful resources that outline problems, pitfalls, steps needed and compatibility information about each hardware/OS combination. That would be far more helpful than almost every one of these threads turning into the OS/2 vs eCS battles that keep happening.
THIS PART I HOPE EVERYONE READS:
On that note, I will confess, speaking solely for myself and NOT my fellow moderators, I *am* getting a little tired of such threads turning into a battleground over such things... and I am getting tired of having to write such long-winded posts to try to get things back on track. At some point, unless my fellow moderators disagree (which is something we will discuss privately amongst ourselves), I will simply start deleting posts that turn into OS/2 vs eCS attacks (with neat little jabs at each other) if I find them in threads like this. They are not helpful or appropriate. And those jabs at each other are rather childish. For those, (anyone who enjoys such arguments) go make a thread about "Strengths/Weaknesses of installing OS/2 vs eCS on newer/older hardware" - and keep it civil. The borderline attacks that have happened over the years are also not acceptable and may result in post deletion too.
I try to be very tolerant and very calm in these situation, but honestly, without even trying, I can find a dozen threads in a minute of searching, where the conversations have turned into a bash-fest against each other or against either OS/2 or eCS. (to all) Please, let's stop that - so I don't have to be the one to stop it the next time it happens (we all have better things we can be doing than that).
Hi,
I am close to the goal and here some pictures for those interestet in. I was able to get "the best" IRQ selection for PCI in BIOS so everything is working fine and reliable as it ought to. No crashes at all.
As a small replacement for the "not haveing and working Powermanagement" I do use the program "coretemp 0.0.1" from Nicck, that does show me the Temperature of the CPUs (Core by Core) if I need to.
It would be great to have something to watch the Mainboard Temperature as well, but this seems to be a long way. Even though - it is NOT getting hot that much, even less than (sorry but this is the only way to compare something) eCS2 with ACPI.
Here are some pictures - taken with the X200T and OS/2 Merlin in Docking station and 1600X1200 SNAP Resolution):
(As you may see I did play around with the "Layout Palette" to get theses designs, so it is just "ALT and RMB" to change them)
More to come in the Final video.
Here are two more pictures, showing to be Online via UMTS and Firefox 4 playing HTML5 video.
Data rate seems to be slow, compared with the WLAN rate, I have to test this. May be limited because of the Injoy inbuild maximumrate for COM Ports.
Well, it is fast enough for anything else - but to watch Videos streams it is not good enough (for now ;-) )
Please take a look at the x-center - both cores are not forced to work that much :-)
(I am using 100m_SMP kernel, Pictures taken "outside" Dockingstation)
Cheers