OS2World OLD-STATIC-BACKUP Forum
OS/2 - Technical => Hardware => Topic started by: steve b on 2010.01.18, 03:37:04
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I have gotten OS/2 w/USB printing and storage as well as wifi to work on my Dell Latitude D810. It is a 1.86Mhz/533Mhz FSB (Pentium M Dothan), 1Gb ddr2, Intel 2200 wifi, TIx(6)515 cardbus machine. It is wonderfully fast. It has a 15" display, 1680x1050 native, which yields about 8.2"h screen (practically the same as my Tecra 1024x768.) When I run WinXP, I like 1280x800. When I run 900 ln display in OS/2, I get a shrunk display with the same image height as 1050 ln. I do not get widescreen without stretch which introduces distortion. I got a D810 because I thought that widescreen was supported by snap. I've searched and can't find where I got that idea. So, in retrospect, a D610 would have been fine, but still I would have the cardbus issue. So, in view of the extremely reasonable prices on older Thinkpads, I have been thinking....
It appears that most T42s and 43s with 15" screens are sxga+, 1400x1050, which would yield a screen height of 9.2" with ~20% more linear resolution than 1024x768 that I'm used to. Bigger sharper image, good for aging eyes. Also it appears from Neil's posts that cardbus and USB will work on these machines, which makes sense. I mean Dani and IBM and APsoft have written drivers for a bunch of TI controllers, but all the Latitudes use this x515 thing. I had some pretty discouraging weeks because the cardbus/drivers were not only not working (you would think that x515 would include everything from 1515 to 9515) but they were messing up USB (Thanks to Mr Jinx). So, if I'm right about this, if I get a Thinkpad, I will be able to use my pc card modem, my scsi scanner and get a larger, sharper display, although not widescreen.
Wiki said the T43 was reported to run hot and noisy. It also uses the newer ddr2 memory, but I don't think that will matter much to me.
I primarily use my computer to access the Web via dialup (wifi is very nice when traveling, but I get my neighbors wifi signals in my house and fear that it won't work well for what I'd be willing to put into it) for less than an hour a day when I don't have computer issues :) and word processing, occasional image printing and scanning rarely. I do have a number of specialized OS/2 programs I use sporadically, such as skywatch when I was learning celestial navigation. I infrequently run on battery, but that was before wifi and traveling.
I feel inclined to a 15" T42 with 1Gb ram, said to run quieter, cooler and more efficiently than the T43. If that is inaccurate or hyperbole, I would like to get a T43. I would like to get the best (within reason) OS/2 machine I can now. I believe in 5 years it will be necessary to replace my computer and peripherals, but I would like to delay that as long as possible.
It appears that all the 15" Rs are XGA (1024x768) which to me is a waste of a 15" display. Suggestion and corrections appreciated. Steve
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For the video issues, check this post:
http://www.os2world.com/forum/index.php/topic,1667.msg11426/topicseen.html#msg11426
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Both T42 and T43(p) work very well with eCS (writing from a T43p).
The T43 and T43p are indeed much warmer, although also faster. T43 are somewhat restricted regarding harddisk (SATA-PATA bridge issue and error message, not eCS specific), while the T42 is prone to the flexing problem.
However in daily usage there not much difference and I prefer the T43.
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Before you go and buy something note that the T42 basic version only had a 1200 x800 screen, they were available with anything up to WUXGA though
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What is the flexing problem on a t42? Is that where the display becomes very dim?
On the sata/pata bridge, (t43) does that always cause an error message? Is it possible to run a sata HDD with some physical modification?
Should I avoid machines with the Intel GMA, 1871-xxx to 1876-xxx? It appears some t43s came with 15" displays w/1024x768 res. I have 1024x768 on a 14" display, which is OK, but I certainly wouldn't want to go lower, especially on my 'dream' machine.
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I have a T43 (1871-W8M) it works pretty good, but does have a few problems. Some comments:
The machine does not work perfectly with ACPI. Suspend/resume is only a dream, but speed control, using SETGETSTATE.EXE works. That means that it can be temperature controlled. I built a REXX script to monitor for activity over 90%, and when that happens, it turns it to full speed, then watches for the activity to drop again so it can slow it down again. The difference between running at full speed , and the slowest speed (where it usually runs), according to the Reactor temperature widget, is 70C at full speed, and 45C at slow speed. This also extends the battery life, which is pretty good, even at high speed. I suspect that this approach should work with most ThinkPads that will cooperate with ACPI to a certain extent.
The screen is a 15 inch, with 1024x768 resolution. It is more than acceptable, IMO.
Noise is not noticeable, at any time (unless you turn the sound up, and play sounds).
NETWORKING: The Broadcom wired (1 Gigabit), and Intel 2915abg wireless (54 megabit) both work well with GENMAC and XWLAN. Some LEARNING is required to figure out how to make it work properly, but it does work nicely.
USB: There 4x USBUHCI controllers, and 1x USBEHCI controller. However, there are only two connectors on the case. You need a docking station to use the others.
SERIAL/MODEM: It has a built in WinModem, that does NOT work with eCS. It also has a serial port, but the only way to use it is with a docking station.
Memory: This machine has 1.5 GiB, and it works well. If I discount the memory used for disk cache, eCS almost never uses more than about 512 meg anyway. The only time I exceed that is when i run one of the virtual machines.
Hard disk: This is one weakness. This machine has a 60 GiB disk, where about 5 GB is taken by the recovery partition. That is used to restore the XP Pro, if you want to use windows. With a little work (and DFSEE) you can remove that, and restore it later, if you like. It has a DVD writer, so offloading stuff that doesn't really need to be on the hard disk, is quite easy.
MOUSE: It has both the Trackpoint, and a touchpad. I HATE the touchpad, so i turn that off in the BIOS. The Trackpoint is usable, after you get used to it. I bought a small, wireless, USB mouse, which works well with AMouse.
PCMCIA/PCCard: It has one socket for these devices. It seems to work with the driver that I have, but I am not sure which driver it really is, since nothing seems to display that information. The installer is called CARDBUS.EXE, and it is dated 08/20/2009, which I am sure is not correct (it is probably when I downloaded it). There is also a socked for EXPRESS Cards (whatever those are). I have no way to test if that actually works, or not.
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DougB, I appreciate your input, and generally assuaged my concerns and raised a major one: serial port usage.
I have to be able to use the serial port wo/ docking station. Steve
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So, after a cursory search, it appears that t42s come with a serial port, and t43s don't, unless you use a docking station, is that correct?
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ok, my current one is a IBM ThinkPad T43p (2668-F8G). Main difference to Dougs model is that mine has a ATI X600 (FireGL) video chip, which is also supported by SNAP. It has a 1600x1200 15" panel. Before that one I had a different but similar T43 (2668-92G), which also had an ATI (X300), but only 1400x1050 resolution on a 15" panel. I must confess I liked the lower resolution better. 1024x768 would be inacceptable for me because I need to VNC into several servers running at 1024x768.
Both Thinkpads are equipped with a 80GB harddisk. The one from the T43p spins with 7200 rpm and is noticiably faster while the other one only spins with 5400 rpm. Recovery partition is present (chooseable via bootmanager).
You cannot plug a SATA harddisk into these machines (no known hardware mod exists). In addition it is almost impossible to get a bigger harddisk as only very few harddisks with a special firmware are supported. Otherwise the BIOS will always nag you with an error message upon every single reboot.
I am not using ACPI but old APM driver, suspend/resume works nicely. I cannot influence the fans like Doug can (and which might make me try ACPI). The T43p is hotter, but not much. I have no exact figures like Doug has.
Otherwise I can confirm everything that Doug wrote.
A very good resource for Thinkpads is http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/ThinkWiki (http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/ThinkWiki).
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So, after a cursory search, it appears that t42s come with a serial port, and t43s don't, unless you use a docking station, is that correct?
It may depend on individual models. There are a number of T42 and T43 models. Some may have things like serial ports, and higher resolution screens, while others don't. You need to carefully investigate whatever you buy.
I am not using ACPI but old APM driver, suspend/resume works nicely. I cannot influence the fans like Doug can (and which might make me try ACPI). The T43p is hotter, but not much. I
The fan is controlled by the system, the software doesn't seem to have any control. All I can do is lower the speed, which does cool things down. It also seems that the 1871-W8M does not support APM (or APM doesn't support the machine), so the only option that I have for power control is ACPI, and that is somewhat limited since Suspend/Resume won't work.
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ok, my current one is a IBM ThinkPad T43p (2668-F8G). Main difference to Dougs model is that mine has a ATI X600 (FireGL) video chip, which is also supported by SNAP. It has a 1600x1200 15" panel. Before that one I had a different but similar T43 (2668-92G), which also had an ATI (X300), but only 1400x1050 resolution on a 15" panel. I must confess I liked the lower resolution better. 1024x768 would be inacceptable for me because I need to VNC into several servers running at 1024x768.
The T43 with the ATI x300 are the fastest under SNAP graphics. The FireGL support is, according to Sci Tech when I asked them, not accelerated. But to get 1600 x 1200, you need to have FireGL.
T43 2xxx have OS/2 APM support and will do suspend and resume. T43 1xxx will not.
You can freely upgrade the hard drive with almost any IDE (not SATA) drive, buy you will get Error 2010 when you boot. As long as your BIOS is up to date, you can press F1 and boot anyway.
There are a limited number of 120 GB drives that boot without error -- all T43 on my website now feature those drives.
Running hot does not seem to be much of an issue for T43, except that the fan works harder. I find many of the most selective OS/2 users have picked the T43.
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The T43 with the ATI x300 are the fastest under SNAP graphics. The FireGL support is, according to Sci Tech when I asked them, not accelerated. But to get 1600 x 1200, you need to have FireGL.
SNAP recognizes the Mobility FireGL V3200 (device according to PCI.EXE) in the T43p as ATI Mobility Radeon X600 and it is accelerated.
From the SNAP graphics.log:
Graphics device configuration:
Manufacturer......... ATI
Chipset.............. Mobility Radeon X600
Bus Type............. PCI Express
Memory............... 131072 KB
DAC.................. ATI Internal 24 bit DAC
Clock................ ATI Internal Clock
Memory Clock......... 250 MHz
Default Memory Clock. 250 MHz
Maximum Memory Clock. 250 MHz
Driver Revision...... 3.2, Build 28
Driver Build......... Jun 17 2005
Certified Version.... 1.60
Certified Date....... Jun 21 2005
Graphics device options:
Invert .................. Off
Rotation ................ Off
Flipped ................. Off
Prefer 16 bit per pixel.. On
Prefer 32 bit per pixel.. On
PCI bus mastering........ On
Hardware acceleration.... Full
From SysBench:
Graphics card - ATI Technologies Inc - M24GL [Mobility FireGL V3200]
Graphics
BitBlt S->S copy : 1259.985 Million pixels/second
BitBlt M->S copy : 486.953 Million pixels/second
Filled Rectangle : 4399.993 Million pixels/second
Pattern Fill : 3999.719 Million pixels/second
Vertical Lines : 101.402 Million pixels/second
Horizontal Lines : 1757.460 Million pixels/second
Diagonal Lines : 46.623 Million pixels/second
Text Render : 329.470 Million pixels/second
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Total : 643.925 PM-Graphics-marks
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All replies helped make my purchase decision, which is a Type 2687-D4U, with attendant cmos battery needing replacement.
I will probably need a usb to serial adapter for the rare occasion I use my gps and Tom D's Movemap. I'm hoping the t43 display will be viewable outdoors. Anyway an initial search for the tested ones yielded no results. Kind of scary. Steve
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Just for the records: I had the chance to try the following:
You may plug a 2 GB DDR2-RAM SO-DIMM into a T43, in case the total ammount of RAM exceeds 2 GB, it will also be reported correctly in the BIOS setup, however the OS (both eCS and Windows) sees only 2 GB (as noted in the specs the T4x allow only a maximum of 2 GB RAM).
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A BIOS update may be suggested as well for any of the T43 line. There have been numerous fixes and updates to the BIOS since the initial release. The new BIOS can be found on either the IBM or Lenovo website - just ensure that the TYPE number the BIOS is for matches the machine's TYPE number.