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Networking MAC and OS/2

Started by Ted, 2008.12.29, 07:23:56

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Ted

Hi,

I want to connect a MacBook, running Leopard 10.5, to my Peer network.
Currently the Peer network has three computers on it, two running
eComstation 1.2R and the other with Warp 4.51.  The Warp 4.51 computer is
my office desktop and it serves as the Injoy PC (the gateway).  Yes, I am
among the only 10% or so of the computer-using population that still uses
dial-up.  The other two are ThinkPad T23s, both with eCS 1.2R.

I guess I have two problems.

1. I want the MacBook to see the Injoy PC and see it's connection to the
internet.  The Injoy PC, of course, is using the Injoy Dialer with the
Network Address Translation (NAT) feature.

2. I want the add the MacBook to my Peer Network, so that files can be
shared and so the MacBook can use the printer - which is attached to the
Injoy PC.

As to #1.

On the MacBook, in Network/Ethernet, I chose manual configuration and for
IP address I gave it 192.168.1.9.  (The Injoy, or gateway, computer is
192.168.1.1 and the two ThinkPads are 192.168.1.2 and 192.168.1.3).  The
Subnet mask is 255.255.255.0.  For router I entered 192.168.1.1, which is
the gateway computer.  I didn't know what to enter for DNS Server, so I
included several IP addresses, including that for the local host
(127.0.0.1) and the gateway PC.  I didn't enter anything in the "Search
domains" field.  Under advanced there is an opportunity to configure IPv6;
I don't know that that is, and left it set to Automatic.

Having specified these things, the MacBook can ping the gateway PC, but
(unlike the ThinkPads) it doesn't see the internet connection.  What else
do I need to configure or specify to get the MacBook to see the Gateway
PC's internet connection?

As to #2.

Under Sharing in System Preferences I selected File Sharing and designated
certain folders to be shared.  Under Options I selected Share Files and
Folders using AFP and Share Files and Folders using SMB.  I suspect the not
both of these is needed -- but which one is the one to use?

Having done this, the other machines on the Peer network do not see the
Macbook (looking in the Shared Resources and Connections folder under
Shares).

Also, in the MacBook I do not see anyplace to activate connections (that
is, shares made available by other computers on the network).  How is this
done?

In short, how to I set up Peer Networking on the Mac?

Thanks.

Ted Kildegaard

Pete

Hi Ted

1) Looks like the problem is simply that you have not specified a DNS server so there is no chance of "going internetting" until that is resolved.

Your ISP will have DNS servers. If your router is set to automatically get an IP Address using DHCP you may find a router option to automatically get DNS servers as well. If not you need to know the ip address of the ISP DNS servers which you can then enter in the router setup and specify the router as the DNS server in the mac tcpip config section - or directly enter the DNS addresses there.


2) Not really up on mac networking but think AFP is the older "apple only" network.

As you are using SMB you will probably need to install the samba server and client on your OS/2 based systems as the OS/2 File and Print client does not work too well - if it works at all - with current implementations of samba on linux systems; I would think that applies to the mac as well.


Hope the above is of some help.

Pete

Blonde Guy

Pete's response is somewhat misleading. Checking the router would be great for a user with a router, but Ted pointed out he is using an OS/2 computer with a modem.

I use a Macintosh computer with Mac OS X 10.4 (Tiger) and OS 9.2. I share printers and files.

But his point 1 is generally correct. Ted, the original poster, has chosen to use static IP. This is more difficult to use than DHCP, but it works. The Mac needs an IP address, netmask, gateway address and name server (DNS) addresses. These are easy to put in, and if any one is wrong, then the Mac won't be able to use the Internet. From the symptoms, either gateway or name server address is wrong.

Personally, I use DHCP, but back in my InJoy Dialer days, I used static IP just the way Ted did. And InJoy dialer was insanely great. Any time the Mac needed the internet, it would cause OS/2 to dial out and hang up when it was done.

Sharing using SMB under Mac OS X 10.4 (Tiger) and 10.5 (Leopard) is broken. Don't use it with OS/2 File and Print. Use FTP instead to give the Mac read-only access to OS/2 shares. AFP is old; don't use it. Sharing/Connecting on the Mac is located in Finder under "Go to Server".

Instead, set up your printer on your OS/2 machine as LPD. The Mac will have no problem discovering and using your printer.

Neil
Expert Consulting for OS/2 and eComStation

Ted

Hi Pete and Neil,

Thank you for your replies. I think you have given me enough information to
make some real progress! I won't be able to work on this until this
evening, however, because today my son has the MacBook at his uncle's
house, where he can access the internet over wi-fi. I do have some
questions, however.

First, about the DNS address. This is assigned dynamically by my ISP. As I
recall, when I was configuring the ThinkPads I just used the IP addresses
shown in the gateway PC's RESOLV2 file. Iac, the Thinkpads have no trouble
seeing the Injoy PC's connection to the internet.

Neil, you said "From the symptoms, either gateway or name server address is
wrong." Since the MAC says the ethernet is active, and since it can ping
the gateway computer, it must be the name server address which is wrong.
I'll try the values in the gateway's RESOLV2 file.

But why do any 'beyond-the-gateway' addresses need to be specified here? As
I understand it, packets from the networked PCs (other than the Injoy PC
itself) are directed to the Injoy PC (because they have that PC's IP
address, as the router or gateway address). The Injoy (gateway) computer
then sends them out over the internet after re-addressing them (NAT) using
whatever IP address has been assigned. So why do the non-gateway PC's need
any 'beyond-the-gateway' addresses?


Regarding sharing, Neil said SMB is broken, AFP is old, and to "Use FTP
instead to give the Mac read-only access to OS/2 shares." I'll try that.
With read-only access, will it be possible to copy documents from the OS/2
computers to the MAC?

Thanks again for all the information. As I mentioned, I won't be able to do
anything until this evening. I'll post a note here tomorrow about how it
goes.

Ted

Paul Smedley

Quote from: Blonde Guy on 2008.12.29, 17:46:31
Sharing using SMB under Mac OS X 10.4 (Tiger) and 10.5 (Leopard) is broken. Don't use it with OS/2 File and Print. Use FTP instead to give the Mac read-only access to OS/2 shares. AFP is old; don't use it. Sharing/Connecting on the Mac is located in Finder under "Go to Server".

Instead, set up your printer on your OS/2 machine as LPD. The Mac will have no problem discovering and using your printer.

I use SMB on our MacBook running MacOS 10.5.6 to connect to my Samba server on a daily basis.  SMB may be broken connecting to IBM Peer - but that's probably cos IBM Peer is so old and out of date - Vista IIRC has issues talking to it too.

I also use lpd to connect my Mac to our printer - only difference our printer is hanging off a network print server.

Cheers,

Paul.

Blonde Guy

Quote from: Paul Smedley on 2008.12.30, 01:55:01

I use SMB on our MacBook running MacOS 10.5.6 to connect to my Samba server on a daily basis.  SMB may be broken connecting to IBM Peer - but that's probably cos IBM Peer is so old and out of date - Vista IIRC has issues talking to it too.


So, are you recommending that Ted

1. set up SAMBA server on each OS/2 box
2. set up SAMBA client on each OS/2 box

in order to get the Mac to share files?

Can Ted run SAMBA and OS/2 File and Print at the same time?

Neil
Expert Consulting for OS/2 and eComStation

Ted

Paul,

Thanks for chiming in.

> SMB may be broken connecting to IBM Peer - but
> that's probably cos IBM Peer is so old and out of date - Vista IIRC has
> issues talking to it too.

What are the alternatives? Is there a more up-to-date way for eCS users to
network their computers?

Thanks,

Ted

Ted

Hi Neil,

> The Mac needs an IP address, netmask, gateway address and name server
> (DNS) addresses. These are easy to put in, and if any one is wrong, then
> the Mac won't be able to use the Internet. From the symptoms, either
> gateway or name server address is wrong.

Evidently the latter was wrong. I looked at the Injoy PC's RESOLV file to
get the DNS addresses to put in the Macbook, and the Macbook is now
connected to the internet over the Injoy PC gateway. So I have success on
this score!

> ,,, back in my InJoy Dialer days, I used static IP
> just the way Ted did. And InJoy dialer was insanely great. Any time the
> Mac needed the internet, it would cause OS/2 to dial out and hang up when
> it was done.

This is what the Thinkpads do, and now I expect the MAC will, too. It does
work well, except for one thing: If I leave Injoy (on the Injoy PC) in DOD
mode, it sometimes dials and connects when no one is doing anything at any
of the computers. I don't know what triggers this, but I have learned to
close Injoy when no one is using any of the computers.

> Use FTP instead to give the Mac read-only access to OS/2 shares.

I checked FTP (instead of SMB and AFP). It says FTP is on and other
machines can access the Mac's files by going to file:/// or browsing for
Mac (the Macbook's name is simply "Mac"). The other computers can't find
it, though, so something is still missing.

> Sharing/Connecting on the Mac is located in Finder under "Go to Server".

In this Leopard 10.5 Finder the "Go" pulldown menu doesn't include
"Server", but it does have "Network". Choosing that opens a window labeled
"Network" but nothing is listed there. I will play with this some more, to
see if I can spot what might  be missing.

> Instead, set up your printer on your OS/2 machine as LPD. The Mac will
> have no problem discovering and using your printer.

I am not familiar with this. Would I have to do more than just start LPD at
a command prompt? Can you refer me to any source of information about how to use the LP Daemon?

Thanks for your your help and information. I am happy to have gotten the
Mac to use the Injoy PC's internet connection. I'll spend some more time
with Sharing to see if I can get that going, too. Can you think of what I
might have missed in Sharing?

Ted

Paul Smedley

Quote from: Blonde Guy on 2008.12.30, 06:57:23
Quote from: Paul Smedley on 2008.12.30, 01:55:01

I use SMB on our MacBook running MacOS 10.5.6 to connect to my Samba server on a daily basis.  SMB may be broken connecting to IBM Peer - but that's probably cos IBM Peer is so old and out of date - Vista IIRC has issues talking to it too.


So, are you recommending that Ted

1. set up SAMBA server on each OS/2 box
2. set up SAMBA client on each OS/2 box

in order to get the Mac to share files?

Can Ted run SAMBA and OS/2 File and Print at the same time?

Samba server and OS/2 File and Print can run at the same time provided that OS/2 File and Print is NOT using TCPBEUI - otherwise they're both trying to listen on the same port (139)

I'm assuming Ted only runs the File and Print server on one machine, I'm suggesting he tries using Samba server on that machine instead.  IBM Peer client can talk to Samba, so can MacOS.

Samba Server is available from http://svn.netlabs.org/samba - there's even a warpin installer with nice icons to make things easier to use/install.

Cheers,

Paul.

Blonde Guy

Quote from: Ted on 2008.12.30, 23:49:30

> Use FTP instead to give the Mac read-only access to OS/2 shares.

I checked FTP (instead of SMB and AFP). It says FTP is on and other
machines can access the Mac's files by going to file:/// or browsing for
Mac (the Macbook's name is simply "Mac"). The other computers can't find
it, though, so something is still missing.


You've started the FTP server on the Mac. I was trying to get you to use the client.
Expert Consulting for OS/2 and eComStation

Ted

> You've started the FTP server on the Mac. I was trying to get you to use the
> client.

I am sorry, Neil, I have no idea what that means. As we go along you are learning about my ignorance about these things. I have never understood the terms "server" and "client" as they relate to computers.

In a peer network, conceptully the networked computers have equal status and there are no servers and clients. In this case, since once of the networked computers is the "gateway" and the one with the printer, I would have thought that one would be considered a server (and the others, including the Macbook, would be clients). In any case, when you say you were trying to get me to use the client, can you spell it out with different terminology?  Thanks.

Ted

Ted

Hi Paul,

> I'm assuming Ted only runs the File and Print server on one machine, I'm \
> suggesting he tries using Samba server on that machine instead.  IBM Peer
> client can talk to Samba, so can MacOS.

My peer network currently has three computers on it. When and if I learn how to do it, the Macbook will be the fourth.

Ted

Pete

Hi Ted

Think of a Peer network in terms of each PC/Mac/Whatever on the network is both "client" and "server": It is a "client" when asking other systems on the network for files or shared resources; It is a "server" when supplying files or shared resources to other systems on the network.

Regards

Pete

Blonde Guy

OK, to define the terms,

A server shares files. When you share a drive, your computer is acting as a server.

A client browses shared files. When you access a shared directory on another computer, your computer is a client. Usually computers in File and Print sharing act as both clients and as servers.

The MAC can mount an FTP site such that it looks like a drive in Finder. So if you run an FTP server on your OS/2 computer, then you can use the Mac ftp connection to browse and read (but not write, due to a limitation in the Mac). The Mac is acting as a client in this case. This is an easy, fast way to share files between Mac and eCS.

The terminology is important when implementing SAMBA. The SAMBA software has a server that lets you share files. The Mac can read and write files shared by SAMBA. There is also a SAMBA client that allows an eCS machine to access files on a SAMBA server.
Expert Consulting for OS/2 and eComStation