Author Topic: New Programs  (Read 3843 times)

stevegarrett

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New Programs
« on: 2012.05.20, 03:03:14 »
Hello,

I bought a used computer last week, approximately 10 years old.  It has an AMD Athlon 64 3200 with 2GB of RAM.  It has 2 OS, Windows XP, and OS/2 Warp 4.5 Service Pack 17.  It is very responsive, and runs well, but the programs it came with, with only a few exceptions, seem to be very old, with no modern features.  They are very basic.  Some even look like DOS, without a GUI.  I am very happy to see that it has Firefox and Thunderbird, they are not the newest versions, but work fine.  I use web mail, but I might try Thunderbird, it seems to have a lot of nice features. There is also a nice bittorrent program that's very similar to UTorrent, which is what I use in Windows.

I have a few questions, and probably more later.  For now, I would appreciate some directions in where to find modern software.  I found the web site called Hobbes and searched the categories that I need, but this computer seems to already have the same versions.  A lot of the software I saw dates back to the mid 90's.  Can you provide a link to an up to date web site?

Here are the Windows programs that I would need to use in OS/2.

1.  iTunes, or even better, Media Monkey.  I have an iPod Nano and need to transfer songs back and forth.  I also would like a modern, intuitive user interface.  This computer has a program called Z, but it looks VERY old, without any modern features.  It's one of the programs that I think might even be DOS.  This computer also has a player called PM 123 that looks like a very old basic version of Win Amp.  It's better, but again lacks any modern features. There is a modern video player, VLC (?) that I think played MP3, but it looks like that is all it can do with music files.  Not a proper GUI for music at all.  I couldn't find anything else.  If you can, please provide me a link, or just a name and I can search it out.

2.  I need an office suite like MS Office, or Libre Office (It's free, and very good).  I found a web site the has an old version of Open Office for OS/2, but they charge for it, or say that the charge is for something else, but you can't download it without paying.  Bait and switch I guess.  I hate when companies do that.  I've never heard of anyone charging for it.  I can't pay for it, that is why I bought an old used computer that already had all of the Windows programs that I needed for work and home.  I found a link in your forum to a new version that would be great.  It's Open Office, not Libre Office, but as long as it can use current MS Word files, and .ODT files, I can still use it.  I tried it, but every time I tried to open a document from work, or do anything with it, it crashed.  It looks like it is just a test version.  Is there a stable version somewhere?  I really would need it.

3.  The computer came with a very nice graphics viewer called PM View.  I would definitely use it.  It does have some basic editing ability, and I really like it, but I would also like a graphics program like Photo Shop Elements (not it's big brother), that can do a lot more editing than a viewer.

That's it for now, I'm sure that I will have other questions, but first I need to get some useful programs for OS/2 so I can use it. :-)


melf

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #1 on: 2012.05.20, 11:36:12 »
Hello,

I bought a used computer last week, approximately 10 years old.  It has an AMD Athlon 64 3200 with 2GB of RAM.  It has 2 OS, Windows XP, and OS/2 Warp 4.5 Service Pack 17.  It is very responsive, and runs well, but the programs it came with, with only a few exceptions, seem to be very old, with no modern features.  They are very basic.  Some even look like DOS, without a GUI.  I am very happy to see that it has Firefox and Thunderbird, they are not the newest versions, but work fine.  I use web mail, but I might try Thunderbird, it seems to have a lot of nice features. There is also a nice bittorrent program that's very similar to UTorrent, which is what I use in Windows.

I have a few questions, and probably more later.  For now, I would appreciate some directions in where to find modern software.  I found the web site called Hobbes and searched the categories that I need, but this computer seems to already have the same versions.  A lot of the software I saw dates back to the mid 90's.  Can you provide a link to an up to date web site?

Hi, Hobbes is cetainly up to date, but has both old an new (free) software. http://www.ecomstation.it/ecsoft2/index.php?language=en   might however be an easier place for you to start search software that you want.


Here are the Windows programs that I would need to use in OS/2.

1.  iTunes, or even better, Media Monkey.  I have an iPod Nano and need to transfer songs back and forth.  I also would like a modern, intuitive user interface.  This computer has a program called Z, but it looks VERY old, without any modern features.  It's one of the programs that I think might even be DOS.  This computer also has a player called PM 123 that looks like a very old basic version of Win Amp.  It's better, but again lacks any modern features. There is a modern video player, VLC (?) that I think played MP3, but it looks like that is all it can do with music files.  Not a proper GUI for music at all.  I couldn't find anything else.  If you can, please provide me a link, or just a name and I can search it out.

You can forget about programs like iTunes, Spotify, Skype etc - they are simply not made for eCS-OS/2. eCS (which is the new flavour of OS/2) has the latest ten years tried to catch up with time, but on small economic and developmental resources. You can't compare with Windows or Linux with regard to applications - that is not meaningful. However there are a lot of useful apps. Z has a lot of features as I remember, PM123 is updated on a regular basis and can play about most filetypes, can add features on pluginbasis - it does everthing you could expect of music player.

2.  I need an office suite like MS Office, or Libre Office (It's free, and very good).  I found a web site the has an old version of Open Office for OS/2, but they charge for it, or say that the charge is for something else, but you can't download it without paying.  Bait and switch I guess.  I hate when companies do that.  I've never heard of anyone charging for it.  I can't pay for it, that is why I bought an old used computer that already had all of the Windows programs that I needed for work and home.  I found a link in your forum to a new version that would be great.  It's Open Office, not Libre Office, but as long as it can use current MS Word files, and .ODT files, I can still use it.  I tried it, but every time I tried to open a document from work, or do anything with it, it crashed.  It looks like it is just a test version.  Is there a stable version somewhere?  I really would need it.

OpenOffice is updated regularly. Version 3.4 will be released soon. To get you have to have a Software subscription, otherwise you need to download sources and compile for yourself. Again, the community is small and can't offer this work for free.


3.  The computer came with a very nice graphics viewer called PM View.  I would definitely use it.  It does have some basic editing ability, and I really like it, but I would also like a graphics program like Photo Shop Elements (not it's big brother), that can do a lot more editing than a viewer.


Photshop and the like is not made for eCS-OS/2. Take your time and look through the eCSoft software guide (the link above) to find other image manipulation softwares.



« Last Edit: 2012.05.20, 12:14:07 by melf »
/Mikael

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #2 on: 2012.05.20, 17:19:53 »
About topic 2.-

Why don't update Firefox to version 10 on OS/2 and start using Google Docs (docs.google.com)? I had been using it and works fine on the browser. That is an alternative if you have the OS/2 machine connected to the internet.
Martín Itúrbide
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sXwamp

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #3 on: 2012.05.20, 21:11:11 »

I have a few questions, and probably more later.  For now, I would appreciate some directions in where to find modern software.  I found the web site called Hobbes and searched the categories that I need, but this computer seems to already have the same versions.  A lot of the software I saw dates back to the mid 90's.  Can you provide a link to an up to date web site?


Os/2 ReleaseNotes files:
http://www.os2notes.com/os2files.html

eCSoft/2
http://www.ecomstation.it/ecsoft2/index.php?menutype=plain&language=en

Paul S. ports
http://os2ports.smedley.info/index.php


Greggory

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #4 on: 2012.05.20, 22:50:24 »
Hello,

you have several options as complement to PMView
3.  The computer came with a very nice graphics viewer called PM View.  I would definitely use it.  It does have some basic editing ability, and I really like it, but I would also like a graphics program like Photo Shop Elements (not it's big brother), that can do a lot more editing than a viewer.

Embellish* or GIMP may be something to look at for you.

You can either go for some "native" alternative that was made form OS/2-eCS to begin with or try graphics software that has been ported to the platform. New software doesn't always work better, even though bugs may have been corrected in newer versions. Some software manufacturers introduce new bugs with new versions.

I personally prefer the "native" Embellish v2.02
It's easy to use once you grasp the basics
1. Show the 3 toolbars and save their window position
2. Almost all buttons are disabled until you open/create an image
3. Grab/copy/paste magic and freehand shaped areas
4. Manipulate Objects/Layers/transparency etc.
5. GIF animation and HTML imagemap creation built in

Install with eCO Market

Info:
Embellish v2.01, Embellish v2.02 & Tips

Drawback:
Doesn't show/select exactly as you intend when you zoom over a certain level
May become unstable with large images/areas/objects
__
TrueSpectra Photo>Graphics Pro v2.0
produce nice graphics but may need additional info how to use it
Download TrueSpectra Photo>Graphics Pro v2.0 from Hobbes (last link)

Info:
Review

___
GIMP 2.2.8 that use XFree86
Download: GIMP 2.2.8 from Hobbes
Info: GIMP 2.2.8
___
ImpOS/2
?
___
PhotoTiger
?
___
Pixel cost money and is buggy on all platforms and no fixes seem to have been made available

*You can probably replace the button images that come with Embellish if you want to create your own zazzy versions as apps store resources very accessible.
Example how to improve OS/2 Chess if you follow the instructions found here
« Last Edit: 2012.05.21, 10:09:22 by jep »

stevegarrett

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #5 on: 2012.05.21, 12:01:46 »
Melf - Thanks for the information, and the link to eCSoft/2.  eCSoft/2 seems to have the same software as Hobbes for the most part, although it has a much nicer, more up to date user interface, and includes screen shots, etc. Very usable, and very useful.  I searched through the categories where I am trying to find OS/2 versions comparable to their Windows counterparts.  Unfortunately, as you eluded to, there just aren't many, and in some cases, ANY.  Regarding the discussion about PM123, while it works fine as a basic player, unfortunately it is the equivalent of MP3 players from several years ago.  If you have access to Windows, you could download Media Monkey, or iTunes to see how far media players have evolved since the early WinAmp days, which is what PM123 is on par with.  Music is an important part of my life, so this was disappointing.

The lack of a freely downloadable version of LibreOffice, or even OpenOffice is a lot more serious.  Without it, I can't work on Libre Office (ODT), or MS Word (DOC) files. If you were serious in Your suggestion to download sources and compile it myself, I'm afraid that I am not a candidate for that sort of thing, having neither the know how, or the time to learn how.  I guess my hope would be that newer, more stable, compiled versions of 3.4 are placed on Apache.  I keep checking the location where I found the full OS/2 version r1299571, but so far there are no updates, and all of the other platforms are now several versions ahead.  If anyone has more information about this, please let me know.

One thing that I was very happy to find on eCSoft/2 was an OS/2 Package of Ccrypt 1.9 supplied by Elbert Pol, and separately, a GUI front end called QCCrypt. This should enable me to encrypt / decrypt across both OS.
----------------------
Martin - Thank you for your Firefox suggestion, however I already had Firefox 10.0.2.  I searched for a current version, but the latest available for OS/2 seems to be 10.0.4, so I installed that.  Firefox has been at version 12 since April. Because of all the security & stability updates, I try to keep up to date, but version 10 will do for now.  Maybe version 12 will be available soon?  It was sort of nostalgic having to install an update from a ZIP file instead of an installer.  It reminded me of how we did things years ago.
----------------------
Greggory - Os/2 Release Notes was a very good tip.  Thanks.  I found a lot of useful info and links there, and I will revisit once I am a bit more up to speed and can hopefully find the software that I need.  Under the section “WPS Enhancers”, Desktop Wizard sounded interesting, but the download link was broken, so I'll try and find it later.  There was also a broken link to AudioCD Creator, but after checking on this computer, I realized it was already installed.  I haven't burned anything yet, so I'll give it a try.  The Questions of the Week section looked like a good idea, but as I started to read questions, I realized that the column had been taken over by a spammer, or spammers.
----------------------
Jep - Thanks for your input on Embellish.  This computer has Embellish, Photo>Graphics Pro, & Photo Tiger.  It does not have GIMP, or ImPOS2.  I've tried working with Embellish, as well as Photo Tiger.  While Embellish has some editing capabilities, It's crashed on at least 3 occasions already.  I've tried researching it from old newsgroup posts, but apparently, that was a significant problem with Embellish, and the author gave up on it many years ago.  It's a shame that some of these OS/2 programs that show potential were not taken over and improved by another developer.  Photo Tiger is nice, but it's more of a viewer, and so far, PMView is in an entirely different class than other OS/2 viewers.  I'm very impressed by it.  Yesterday I started trying to work with Photo>Graphics, or tried to.  The user interface is different than any graphics programs I've ever seen..... and not in a good way.  I can see that it is capable, more so for creating graphics, than working with or editing existing graphics.  It's definitely not on par with PS Elements.  I'm going to look into GIMP, but from my Linux Head friends comments, it has a very steep learning curve, and "Is not meant for a casual users".  From the Wikipedia description, it seems to have more in common with a semi pro, or pro photographer.
----------------------
To all - Thank you for taking the time to reply.  I'm a bit discouraged, but I haven't given up on OS/2 yet.  I'll spend some more time on it next weekend, or sooner if I get the time.

melf

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #6 on: 2012.05.21, 12:54:49 »
Hi again stevegarrett,

- I took a look at Media Monkey and maybe CDMagic is what you want?  http://www.zworks.de/cdmagic/Newstyle.php4?YLang=2

- No the compiling comment was not serious in that way. I just wanted to point out that the sources are free. You pay for the work to get a working binary.

- About CD-burning. I would go for DVD-Toys instead, a nice GUI, where you maybe will feel at home. http://en.ecomstation.ru/projects/dvdtoys/

/Mikael

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #7 on: 2012.05.21, 13:38:04 »
OpenOffice come from StarOffice that was developed for OS/2 (5.1 was the latest) and Windows by a german company called StarDivision. Sun bought them and created StarOffice and OpenOffice and removed the OS/2 parts.  >:(
The developers of the OS/2-eCS version had to put such things back into OpenOffice... just to find that the Linux guys removed those parts again as they created LibreOffice...  >:(
OpenOffice is the product for OpenOffice ODT/ODS/OD... files, the code removal is in part a cause to why it cost money and lag behind a bit.



The lack of a freely downloadable version of LibreOffice, or even OpenOffice is a lot more serious.  Without it, I can't work on Libre Office (ODT), or MS Word (DOC) files. If you were serious in Your suggestion to download sources and compile it myself, I'm afraid that I am not a candidate for that sort of thing, having neither the know how, or the time to learn how.  I guess my hope would be that newer, more stable, compiled versions of 3.4 are placed on Apache.  I keep checking the location where I found the full OS/2 version r1299571, but so far there are no updates, and all of the other platforms are now several versions ahead.  If anyone has more information about this, please let me know.

« Last Edit: 2012.05.21, 14:19:32 by jep »

Pete

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #8 on: 2012.05.21, 16:57:46 »
Hi

You may want to see if jphotobrushpro is of use to you http://www.jphotobrushpro.com/

Regards

Pete

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #9 on: 2012.05.21, 20:45:00 »
Has anyone attempted to run LibreOffice under Odin?

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #10 on: 2012.05.22, 01:09:22 »
PMview is indeed a very good software. For viewing and editing RAW images (PMview will support them probably at the end of the year, according to the author) you may use GBM : http://heikon.home.tlink.de/

With regards to mp3, I use Z!. I have a large music collection and Z! suits my needs. I know it doesn't have a slick interface, but since I usually play single songs to suit my mood and don't use playlists It's good enough in combination with FC/2 to select the file to be played. I imagine that with some rexx the PM could be customized to suit any individual need, even without directly using any player.

You might have a look at the different QT4 and Java apps available. Not all, but many can be used with OS/2.

Pete

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #11 on: 2012.05.22, 01:29:05 »
Hi

I tried to install LibreOffice using Odin a couple of months back without success.

I've also tried copying the LibreOffice program tree from a Windows installation to eCS and then attempting to run it using Odin. No go - much the same as current OO for Windows.

Regards

Pete



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Re: New Programs
« Reply #12 on: 2012.05.22, 08:39:58 »

----------------------
Martin - Thank you for your Firefox suggestion, however I already had Firefox 10.0.2.  I searched for a current version, but the latest available for OS/2 seems to be 10.0.4, so I installed that.  Firefox has been at version 12 since April. Because of all the security & stability updates, I try to keep up to date, but version 10 will do for now.  Maybe version 12 will be available soon?  It was sort of nostalgic having to install an update from a ZIP file instead of an installer.  It reminded me of how we did things years ago.
----------------------


Firefox 10.0.4 is the current ESR (extended support) version, meaning it was released at the same time as 12 with all security and some stability fixes. It is really meant for enterprise use where they don't like updating every 6 weeks but is the most up to date working version we have. Currently 12 is broken in various ways and due to lack of developers may not be released.

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #13 on: 2012.05.22, 22:36:54 »
Jep - Thanks for your input on Embellish.  This computer has Embellish, Photo>Graphics Pro, & Photo Tiger.  It does not have GIMP, or ImPOS2.  I've tried working with Embellish, as well as Photo Tiger.  While Embellish has some editing capabilities, It's crashed on at least 3 occasions already.  I've tried researching it from old newsgroup posts, but apparently, that was a significant problem with Embellish, and the author gave up on it many years ago.  It's a shame that some of these OS/2 programs that show potential were not taken over and improved by another developer.  Photo Tiger is nice, but it's more of a viewer, and so far, PMView is in an entirely different class than other OS/2 viewers.  I'm very impressed by it.  Yesterday I started trying to work with Photo>Graphics, or tried to.  The user interface is different than any graphics programs I've ever seen..... and not in a good way.  I can see that it is capable, more so for creating graphics, than working with or editing existing graphics.  It's definitely not on par with PS Elements.  I'm going to look into GIMP, but from my Linux Head friends comments, it has a very steep learning curve, and "Is not meant for a casual users".  From the Wikipedia description, it seems to have more in common with a semi pro, or pro photographer.
Beyond a certain file size you can get troubles with Embellish. If its crashing regularly then the database entry is faulty. You can correct this with a file called inifile.cmd, think you can find it on Hobbes. For some reason, some users do know how to corrupt installations, so you might have to reinstall it. Resizing and sharpening is done with PM- View, all other things are mostly done with Embellish. You don't need PS Elements, that's for the push button boys with Windows. Don't forget that most native programs in OS/2 eCS are object oriented. Photo Graphics Pro is such a package, there is much more under the hood, but the main trouble with it is to master it. I'm also not happy with the user interface. There are some free books about the Gimp, but they are with low version numbers. That's why users don't read them, but as with every package, the basics are there, and that's what count. If you want to work with the Gimp you have to get a copy of HOBLink X11 for OS/2, you can then also work with windows (I don't mean that buggy OS) in OS/2-eCS. I never got complaints about my pictures on several photo fora, can even do better sharpening than others. The only thing I miss is HD-things, but in essence this is some pictures stacked.

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Re: New Programs
« Reply #14 on: 2012.05.22, 22:54:32 »
The lack of a freely downloadable version of LibreOffice, or even OpenOffice is a lot more serious.  Without it, I can't work on Libre Office (ODT), or MS Word (DOC) files. If you were serious in Your suggestion to download sources and compile it myself, I'm afraid that I am not a candidate for that sort of thing, having neither the know how, or the time to learn how.  I guess my hope would be that newer, more stable, compiled versions of 3.4 are placed on Apache.  I keep checking the location where I found the full OS/2 version r1299571, but so far there are no updates, and all of the other platforms are now several versions ahead.  If anyone has more information about this, please let me know.
There is certainly a menu item which is called "Save as". Seems that everyone never uses this and always use "Save". But be aware that there is a limit with "Save". Beyond that limit Windows sometimes forget where the file came from (please don't try to correct me, I have to work with Windows on a daily basis ;-() and just drops the file in a "current" directory. With "Save as" you have lots of options, I never had a problem with Office files and other OS systems. Microsoft updates Office every time with so called "new things". The only new thing they do is altering the first bytes in a file, so you need a new version otherwise you can't read the file. For the rest of it, there are no new things in there, only new bugs. Unfortunately Libreoffice is going the same way, the present owner isn't that gentle! So, ask yourself why you need extension .ODT or .DOC latest version that seriously that you can't use .DOC older version or better .TXT or .ASC. Also good to know is that all Windows fonts are copyright Microsoft in most times. As Microsoft wants to have the pdf things in a document, you can bet that with any other system you will get trouble because you don't have the same font on the other system. Stick to the standard!