Author Topic: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel  (Read 17154 times)

saborion2

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #15 on: 2008.04.08, 16:52:57 »
Hi "Criguada",
Quote
BTW, the home page of this "Orion Resources Intl" thing is just the usual placeholder page placed there by domain vendors apparently, and I still am not very impressed by the amount sponsored for such an undertaking.

Let me quote "warpcafe", Global Moderator for you:
Quote
But from a corporate viewpoint, a tangible offering/product is not enough. It needs to be wrapped with service. At least as an option to show that there is professional support and services available for the product. And that's another open checkpoint on the todo-list (for Mensys? Serenity?).
Even if the corporate consumer decides to provide these services on its own... there must be a SPOC or reliable contact for the consumers needs. Even if Mensys builds a supporting network with SoHo-companies... there must be a dedicated, reliable and ORGANIZED backbone at Mensys (or Serenity?) for these SoHos then. This is the main obstacle I see at the moment.

There is a saying that goes like this or something like it; "Were I Not An Eagle Would I With The Birds (Golden Eagles) Have Flown"; so, the question to you is if you have not an interest in the upkeep of the level of the "watering well" from which you are now drinking then why are you here.

BTW, try to do some research for yourself sometimes and understand how certain objectives can be achieved:

Here is an alternative one for you (from this one; Re: "MIF Website" that was intended)

http://www.iadb.org/news/articledetail.cfm?language=EN&artid=1340

Read between the lines sometimes when we wish to make reference to "amount sponsored for such an undertaking".... as you should know that the "appetizers come before the main courses"; and, do let us know when the things that "warpcafe" has professionally pointed out are/would be needed in certain scenarios are in place. Also, let us know when you see the "CASSINI Distribution" emerging.  8) 8) 8)
« Last Edit: 2008.04.08, 21:45:12 by saborion2 »

Fahrvenugen

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #16 on: 2008.04.09, 02:48:52 »
saborion2,

Seeing as how you're extremely interested in seeing Lotus Notes 8 ported to OS/2, I've got an idea:

Why don't you pick up a good "teach yourself to program" and a "teach yourself to port apps" book and start working on the project?

After all, if you start the project of getting Lotus Notes 8 (hannover) to run on OS/2 / eCS, then it is more likely to get done then if no one starts the project.

Just my thoughts.

saborion2

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #17 on: 2008.04.09, 03:43:24 »
Hi "Fahrvenugen"
Re:
saborion2,
Seeing as how you're extremely interested in seeing Lotus Notes 8 ported to OS/2, I've got an idea:

Why don't you pick up a good "teach yourself to program" and a "teach yourself to port apps" book and start working on the project?

After all, if you start the project of getting Lotus Notes 8 (hannover) to run on OS/2 / eCS, then it is more likely to get done then if no one starts the project.

Just my thoughts.

Thank you for your kind thoughts and I will take this opportunity to share a little story with you which goes like this.

A former colleague of mine upon receiving a copy of an "Economic Evaluation" software application quite frankly refused to let other colleagues of ours get hold of that particular application (I would like you in your response to come up with the answer that colleague gave for not wanting to share the knowledge of the existence of the particular application with others) Anyway, here is an hint - consider the differences in the distributions of the Windows vs the Linux Operating Systems; and , the Microsoft's Office vs the OpenOffice, Lotus Notes, Lotus Symphony, Lotus SameTime....

How about if you along with a team take on the project which will allow me to focus on other business matters (business development, marketing...). ;D  BTW, you will have to undertake some application enhancements and if I was in possession of your email address (I suppose you do know where to locate mine from this web site) ... perhaps I could provide you with those details.  ;)
« Last Edit: 2008.04.09, 17:24:43 by saborion2 »

RobertM

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #18 on: 2008.04.21, 22:51:08 »
saborion2,

OK, I have to ask...

What is 'ORION's "CASSINI DISTRIBUTION"'? I've searched the web, and various other links you have provided, but find no information about it whatsoever - much less any relationship to eCS or OS/2.

Google turns up 2 links when searching for it - and both are to posts on this forum.

Please explain for us unenlightened ones...

Thanks,
Robert
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saborion2

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #19 on: 2008.04.21, 23:12:03 »
saborion2,

OK, I have to ask...

What is 'ORION's "CASSINI DISTRIBUTION"'? I've searched the web, and various other links you have provided, but find no information about it whatsoever - much less any relationship to eCS or OS/2.

Google turns up 2 links when searching for it - and both are to posts on this forum.

Please explain for us unenlightened ones...

Thanks,
Robert


Hi "RobertM"

Here is an hint:

Quote
(Applications to be subsequently ported to the IBM OS/2® Warp) Operating Systems.

http://www-304.ibm.com/jct09002c/gsdod/solutiondetails.do?solution=14283&expand=true&lc=en


It is the "proposed" Code-Name for COMFETAR - LIVE on an Open-Sourced (like Linux) VOYAGER (if it is OS/2... all the better)!  8)




RobertM

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #20 on: 2008.04.22, 02:07:29 »

Here is an hint:

Quote
(Applications to be subsequently ported to the IBM OS/2® Warp) Operating Systems.

http://www-304.ibm.com/jct09002c/gsdod/solutiondetails.do?solution=14283&expand=true&lc=en


It is the "proposed" Code-Name for COMFETAR - LIVE on an Open-Sourced (like Linux) VOYAGER (if it is OS/2... all the better)!  8)


I've looked at that - the company seems to have long since dissappeared, and the domain is being handled by a domain parking company.

The particular announcement, even though showing a last modified date of Mar 2008, was submitted in... 2001(?) if memory serves, with no substantial roadmap info our timeline or status update to the content (such as the defunct web link).

Hence, I asked. Yes, I already assumed that you are {...removed by moderator for privacy protection...} (saborion2), so as there is no info that tells us anything about current status, current plans, plans for a website being completed, anything reassuring that IBM is still willing to assist on the project, etc... I asked.

So... answers? ;)

Thanks,
Robert
« Last Edit: 2008.04.22, 08:39:00 by warpcafe »
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saborion2

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #21 on: 2008.04.22, 03:28:43 »
Quite a lot can also be said about:-

Quote

http://www.aibuiltpc.com/Websites.html


Not really a very navigable site.  ???


RobertM

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #22 on: 2008.04.22, 04:33:58 »
Quite a lot can also be said about:-

Quote

http://www.aibuiltpc.com/Websites.html


Not really a very navigable site.  ???

Really? In what way? Besides the fact it is a website (and not a parked domain)...
  • It has descriptions of each site we have worked on
  • It has at least TWO links to each site (the image, and the site name)
  • It has a menu bar at the top that returns you to our other current business area that we are actively advertising for
  • Each page has info about how to contact us

  • And finally, it's not just a parked domain

I don't see the relationship. Is it finished? No. Is it functional in every business aspect that we wish to advertise on the Internet? Yes. Does it have information about our services (repair or websites) with valid links to each? Yes.

I am curious though why you are pointing that out (or what relationship it has to my questions) and why you have still avoided the questions...

This is perplexing me more and more...

Thanks,
Robert
« Last Edit: 2008.04.22, 04:35:44 by RobertM »
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saborion2

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #23 on: 2008.04.22, 05:06:24 »
Re:

Quote
Really? In what way? Besides the fact it is a website (and not a parked domain)...

Here are some cool examples:

Quote
http://www.iadb.org/

http://symphony.lotus.com/software/lotus/symphony/home.jspa

http://www-306.ibm.com/software/lotus/



Robert Deed

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #24 on: 2008.04.22, 06:03:42 »
This is starting to hurt my head, as most threads involving saborion2 do. 

Sab.  I can say this.  If you have a proposed project and are looking for developers you are going about it all wrong.  If you can make a business case that is one thing, though let me say this you are not going to see a substantial return on investment in OS/2.  OS/2 is my platform of choice but I am under no delusion that it is not for everyone.

I actually can not figure out what this entire thread is even about.  There will not be a 64bit OS/2.  The only company who could legally supply that to us is IBM and it is clear they are not going to do that, beyond that it isn't even clear if they COULD supply a 64 bit version of OS/2 with support for both 32bit and 16bit legacy which would be required (since alot of device drivers are still 16bit).

RobertM, I think we should just stop paying attention to all of this.  Would like any information you could provide on your GPS solution for OS/2 since I am working on several different carputers which I would love to be able to say can do GPS.. (lol, i've even tinkered with voicetype to get syncish functions)

Quite a lot can also be said about:-

Quote

http://www.aibuiltpc.com/Websites.html


Not really a very navigable site.  ???

Really? In what way? Besides the fact it is a website (and not a parked domain)...
  • It has descriptions of each site we have worked on
  • It has at least TWO links to each site (the image, and the site name)
  • It has a menu bar at the top that returns you to our other current business area that we are actively advertising for
  • Each page has info about how to contact us

  • And finally, it's not just a parked domain

I don't see the relationship. Is it finished? No. Is it functional in every business aspect that we wish to advertise on the Internet? Yes. Does it have information about our services (repair or websites) with valid links to each? Yes.

I am curious though why you are pointing that out (or what relationship it has to my questions) and why you have still avoided the questions...

This is perplexing me more and more...

Thanks,
Robert


RobertM

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #25 on: 2008.04.22, 06:28:14 »
This is starting to hurt my head, as most threads involving saborion2 do. 

...I actually can not figure out what this entire thread is even about.

So am I... I'm giving up as he hasnt provided one piece of info about anything. All the links point to programs that everyone knows exists, and explains nothing about their relationship (or lack thereof as the case is) to OS/2.

RobertM, I think we should just stop paying attention to all of this.  Would like any information you could provide on your GPS solution for OS/2 since I am working on several different carputers which I would love to be able to say can do GPS.. (lol, i've even tinkered with voicetype to get syncish functions)

Well, we've (our client) has some ToughBooks installed... but is waiting on the county to activate the wireless accounts on it... and we are plodding through the data and methods of drawing it. They have yet to decide on a GPS unit for the vehicles, so programming an interface is on hold for the moment...

Very small steps, and stuck waiting on client decisions. Also finding that the "popular" GPS, namely the Nuvi series doesnt send certain bits of required data which is highly needed for the GPS to work...

Trying to find some workarounds... there is apparently a way to put them in "Data Only" mode to get the data...

Robert
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saborion2

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #26 on: 2008.04.22, 07:13:26 »
Quote
So am I... I'm giving up as he hasnt provided one piece of info about anything. All the links point to programs that everyone knows exists, and explains nothing about their relationship (or lack thereof as the case is) to OS/2.

It appears you guys are not sure what is it exactly you should be looking for after all the hints...

Here, see if this helps to point you to where the money is before you talk your heads off:

Quote

The Multilateral Investment Fund (MIF) Projects


http://www.iadb.org/mif/preparation.cfm?language=English&parid=3&item1id=5



RobertM

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #27 on: 2008.04.22, 08:04:08 »
Quote
So am I... I'm giving up as he hasnt provided one piece of info about anything. All the links point to programs that everyone knows exists, and explains nothing about their relationship (or lack thereof as the case is) to OS/2.

It appears you guys are not sure what is it exactly you should be looking for after all the hints...

Here, see if this helps to point you to where the money is before you talk your heads off:
Quote

The Multilateral Investment Fund (MIF) Projects

http://www.iadb.org/mif/preparation.cfm?language=English&parid=3&item1id=5

This means absolutely nothing.
  • IBM won't Open Source OS/2. Period. They have made that quite clear.
  • IBM won't just hand over the source for Symphony.
  • Comfetar Live seems a dead project, and you refuse to comment on it, it's current status, or anything indicating a relationship to OS/2.
  • Even if something about Comfetar is still "live", the references to OS/2 porting have been on IBM's site since BEFORE IBM pulled the plug on OS/2
  • You SEEM to be suggesting that someone seek funding... for something... what? And more importantly, WHO? Virtually all of us have day jobs. And as for Serenity, do you know anything about their business model or business circumstances to *think* they may be in a position to (or have a desire to) do so? What makes you think they wish to incur a large amount of debt, instead of proceeding in a fashion that wont potentially bankrupt them?

Stop with meaningless hints. If they do have meaning, then spell them out.

Because quite frankly, if there IS meaning, (1) it is eluding us, (2) these games (as they seem to be) would do nothing but turn off potential investors who would research the viability of investing anything in OS/2 or OS/2 solutions when the chief (and only) proponent of this method (of yours) is to play word games and drop nonsensical hints in this forum.

So, please, just spell out whatever you are trying to say.

In the meantime, you may wish to check out this site:

http://www.GeoCodeEngine.com/

Robert
« Last Edit: 2008.04.22, 08:07:28 by RobertM »
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kimhav

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #28 on: 2008.04.22, 10:00:29 »
Hmm.. this thread got a bit weird to figure out.. but the original question was if there ever will be a 64 bit kernel for eComstation. While been looking at Windows XP 64 bit versions and as well Debian I've noticed the issues with drivers and several software packages that just won't work or not stable enough. So going to 64 bit even if we could would generate loads of new issues with the existing code base and that wouldn't help us out.

So, going back to what has been discussed in several threads and as well part what can we do next when knocking on IBM's door?

  • Well, do we have any valid business cases that we can point to that actually would benefit from that IBM opens up the code?
  • Are there specific patents that we can point to that involves OS2 that we would like to get our hands on?
  • IBM claimed that there are legal matters with open up the code; do we know what components that they might try to hide behind that we can exclude from the scope?

All in all; can we create a list of specific components and patents that we really would need to make our life easier and as well on the same time - make it hard for IBM to say no and hide behind legal matters and patents.

RobertM

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Re: Ecomstation 64 Bit Kernel
« Reply #29 on: 2008.04.22, 10:29:18 »
Hi Kim,

So, going back to what has been discussed in several threads and as well part what can we do next when knocking on IBM's door?

  • Well, do we have any valid business cases that we can point to that actually would benefit from that IBM opens up the code?

The insurance industry (IIRC, State Farm used to be entirely OS/2)

The banking/ATM industry (with a solid business, support and distribution model in place, I am sure there would be a growing number of banks who wanted to give up their current headaches in support and maintenance). I'd focus on ATMs first... then move up to client and server machines. ATMs are easy... a few new drivers for the ATM components (if/where needed) such as the cash dispenser, deposit unit... and a good flash video handler - or better yet, a good shockwave/flash engine.

The medical industry for various specialized computer and recordkeeping systems (from experience, they dont care - or even want to know - what their systems are running, as long as it works, and works, and works - and it would also alleviate numerous problems they are having with "stolen" customer records on compromised machines),

The Point of Sale marketplace (there are apparently still a bunch of solution providers who are using OS/2 on these systems - including for dual display cash register setups hooked to dual bar code scanners, serving ads... Giant (MD, DC, VA) was running theirs on Warp 4 as of 2005 (and may still be) - and didnt install it until the early 2000's) - the only "big" thing it would need is updated touchscreen drivers - and the company that makes those screens (there's pretty much only 1 big one here - namely Elo) are willing to provide what's needed to make new drivers (which pretty much amounts to creating a USB version - and maybe different handling to allow RMB actions - but that (RMB) isnt needed for POS based stuff anyway).


  • Are there specific patents that we can point to that involves OS2 that we would like to get our hands on?

The WPS. Patent wise, I dont know what else. Technology wise, the APIs (or documentation to make clean room replacements for them) for the WPS and other subsystems.


  • IBM claimed that there are legal matters with open up the code; do we know what components that they might try to hide behind that we can exclude from the scope?


Believe it or not, I used to have the list of many of them. They came with some developer kit or compiler or with IBM's Directory and Security Server for OS/2 beta (I think that was the name of it). I'll check my VAC++ docs when I get the chance, but...

- Much of the graphics engine (MicroGrafix I believe - and others)
- Much of the MM codecs (numerous contributors)
- LanMan (MS - obsoleted anyway)
- Probably parts of PMShell (MS and others - though there is the PPC implementation)
- Some of the (non-NetBIOS) networking components
- Parts of HPFS (I think)
- There are things online that suggest that parts of the kernel as well (MS and others) - but then again, there is the PPC and other kernels
- Legacy code in WPS (MS) and possibly parts of the API
- Of course the DOS and WinOS2 stuff
- Various core drivers (much of which have been replaced though - and the rest could probably be replaced or licensed)

The list of companies that provided portions of OS/2 was very long. The amount of work they did may have been minimal - or not. I dont know. I do know that MS was just one of many companies that wrote code for OS/2 - and in less sections than the remaining companies.

The problem I see is, in many cases, IBM may outright own the code - while in others, they may be licensing the code, and there is probably no way to determine which is the case without their assistance.




All in all; can we create a list of specific components and patents that we really would need to make our life easier and as well on the same time - make it hard for IBM to say no and hide behind legal matters and patents.

API documentation may be the way... but would require a lot of work. Some of the info could be gleaned from some of their developer kits and compilers. The bugs and errata that numerous programs have come to count on could not be.

I'd ask for the PPC kernel and abstraction layers, OS/2 REXX code, PPC WPS and PM. At the very least, from the PPC kernel/abstraction layers, a replacement should be able to be written for Intel architecture - assuming that the PPC kernel was finished. If so, then it would just be a matter of adding the new API calls added to those subsystems since the PPC days. It would be a start - if they have and can find the code.

Robert[/list]
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